## [RT][HF] A Practical Guide to Evil: Book 4: Chapter 20: Onset * Author: u/Zayits * * URL: https://practicalguidetoevil.wordpress.com/2018/06/13/chapter-20-onset/ * Score: 74 * Created: 2018-06-13T04:00:44 ### Post: [Link to content](https://practicalguidetoevil.wordpress.com/2018/06/13/chapter-20-onset/) ### Comments: > **u/Ardvarkeating101** [+26] *Father of Learning* (25 minutes later) > > DID ANYONE NOTICE THAT CAT, ARCHER, AND MASEGO WERE ALL SLEEPING IN THE SAME BED TOGETHER?!?!?!?!? > > The ship teasing is off the charts! >> **u/panchoadrenalina** [+24] (53 minutes later) >> >> What i believe it happened is that cat was sleeping next to zeze and archer threw herself over them because she is a brat, and we love her for that. >>> **u/Ardvarkeating101** [+18] *Father of Learning* (an hour later) >>> >>> I believe Archer was annexing the bed space, but she was doing that literally in her sleep. >>> >>> Edit: double checked, Cat was worried about waking the other*s* when she got up. OT3 confirmed >> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+11] (12 hours later) >> >> If Archer can swing an nonsexual romance with Masego and a fuckbuddy relationship with Cat she'll have the best of both worlds. That's gotta be her endgame. >> **u/Cariyaga** [+3] *Kyubey did nothing wrong* (4 hours later) >> >> I support platonic Indrani/Cat/Masego ship :D >>> **u/Clipsterman** [+1] (12 hours later) >>> >>> If a ship is platonic, is it *really* a ship? >>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+5] (14 hours later) >>>> >>>> Yes. "Ship" is derived from "relationship," and there's more than one kind of relationship. > **u/cyberdsaiyan** [+19] (2 hours later) > > I love how these meetings which are usually boring af irl is made so tense with all the terminologies and microinsults. > > I also love how this coincided with the Trump-Kim meeting. >> **u/zhaomeng** [+10] (7 hours later) >> >> If only the Trump\-Kim meeting was as exciting lol. I was following it live and that two\-hour block where nobody knew what was signed was hilarious. "They are going to sign...something" are actually words you hear on the news XDD >>> **u/cyberdsaiyan** [+6] (10 hours later) >>> >>> helps that we can hear the internal monologue here. I bet this meeting was just as boring to those who couldn't read the small signs. >> **u/18scsc** [+3] (9 hours later) >> >> The quote at the beginning of the chapter in particular felt like pointed commentary. > **u/Esryok** [+11] (51 minutes later) > > Ah, the battles are always full of wonderful twisty excellence, but these diplomacy/politics chapters are what I love most. Here's to you, diplomacy week! > > I am definitely taking notes for the next time I have to negotiate in an RPG. > **u/RynnisOne** [+9] (9 hours later) > > Fail to see how that comment by Pilgrim is a zinger. > > Cat: "To protect my nation, it's people, and their sovreignty from an invading force that wishes to occupy, conquer, and divide it. I have made and still offer peaceful terms by which the Invaders can leave, which I will still honor, despite numerous attempts by both Named and un-Named to sabotage the peace process despite their claims to being on the side of Good. > > Tell the truth, what is YOUR intent, Pilgrim?" > > She can be 100 percent honest here. >> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+10] (12 hours later) >> >> I don't think Cat's reaction was meant to indicate that Pilgrim's introductory line was a zinger in itself. I think she perceives that he's leading into something that is going to make her life hell. We're not gonna know what that is until the next update. >>> **u/melmonella** [+6] *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (14 hours later) >>> >>> Yeah he can ask, like, "what do you intend to do with Akua who totally controlled your body not a day ago" >>>> **u/RynnisOne** [+6] (17 hours later) >>>> >>>> He doesn't know the details of that. >>>> >>>> But, let's assume he does. >>>> >>>> "I intend to keep her contained in the only place I can be absolutely sure she is unable to bring herself back--my cloak. If, however, you want to go hunt down and eliminate the innocent baby she is using as her back up plan should this container be destroyed, feel free, though that doesn't seem too particularly heroic." > **u/ForgottenToupee** [+8] (17 minutes later) > > > negotiations were now being held between the Queen in Callow and the mandated expeditionary force of the First Prince. > > On the one hand, maybe Cat gets a name again. On the other, "Queen" by itself is rather bland. Anyhoo, it certainly seems like something has happened to the Winter mantle >> **u/notagiantdolphin** [+10] (an hour later) >> >> She is recognised as the queen "in" callow at least, rather than Of. Another point towards a name beyond Winter. Semantics games, but they're pretty important so far. >>> **u/TwoxMachina** [+5] (9 hours later) >>> >>> Queen of All Creation in Callow > **u/Yes_This_Is_God** [+7] (42 minutes later) > > Damn, and here I was expecting a thousand more words on the negotiations. > **u/rumblestiltsken** [+6] (7 hours later) > > Totally not part of the story narrative, but can someone explain this: > > Pilgrim thinks cat is a blight on creation by existing, because she is connected to the gods below. > > Cat isn't connected to the gods below, having no name. > > I just don't get it. She literally isn't a villain right now (by his standards, since heroic and villainous actions don't actually define good and evil apparently). >> **u/None** [+21] (8 hours later) >> >> Cat is still Named, she just doesn't have much of Squire left. And Names are powerful Roles but it's not the only Roles that matter. The Gods Below can give weight to whom ever they choose, be they Villain, Hero or neither. Cat's story is tied to Evil and thus she is of the Below until she starts acting for the purpose of the Above. She's no longer as "marked" as a Villain with a Name but she's still Named in the general sense and fighting for Evil. Actions matter more than blessings. >>> **u/aeschenkarnos** [+2] (21 hours later) >>> >>> She seems much more Neutral. She's surrounded herself with Neutral allies: Adjutant, Heirophant, Archer and Thief all seem to be Neutral rather than villainous Names. Does she even *have* an outright villainous ally left? >> **u/RynnisOne** [+9] (9 hours later) >> >> It's a "you're either with us or against us" thing with those Above. If you aren't explicitly on their side then you must be villains, because they are the only Good. >> **u/None** [+6] (9 hours later) >> >> Crackpot theory with (some) evidence: Pilgrim is going to 'unexpectedly' support her. >> >> We know Pilgrim can sense intentions, he can tell Cat just doesn't want more war. >> In the chapter where Cat returns she rags on Pilgrim a lot, mostly for existing. It seems unfair to her that she's getting shot at, but from his perspective Cat was just wrecking the heroes shit and they're in the middle of the battle. >> He's the one who agrees to hear Cat first, she assumes the light blooming at the end of his staff is meant for her, but he doesn't call it until Saint starts to move. >> This quote before he goes to fight 'her': >> > “There is no glory in this,” he warned them. “Bards may write songs, one day, and chronicles sing your praises, but this is earthly luster. We march in the spirit of sacrifice, to bring light into the dark. Do not look ahead or behind, only to each other. There is no salvation to be found save at the hands your comrades.” >> >> Added with his conversation to Saint the chapter or two earlier. He knows he's on the wrong side of the narrative. >>> **u/rumblestiltsken** [+7] (9 hours later) >>> >>> I still think it will go the other way. The oath from Malanza makes it seem more likely that he is the betrayer, and he forces the armies to battle. > **u/TheEngineer923** [+0] (9 hours later) > > Chapters like this one makes me understand the actions of Dread Emperors a lot more. > > Cat lost her way. She used to be known as someone who'd bring a sword and bottle of cheap wine to the table. Then tell the other party that although the wine is shit it's arguably better than getting stabbed. > > Just fucking kill them all, Cat. > > Heroes aren't invincible. The Angels aren't infallible OR immortal and The Story is NOT set in stone. > > If you need help, scry Black. He's sure to have good advice on handling the Pilgrim. The Saint is not overly a problem since she's old and there are hard limits to her power. The other useless angelic toe kissers already fear her power because she has already sent two of them to their ancestors and it would have been a team wipe had the Pilgrim not interfered. > > Replenish your entire numbers by raising them again as Winter Zombies which was proven resistant to the priests' efforts. Their purpose is not to bleed the heroes, but to bleed the Proceran mercenaries and fantassins. Have Larat ride in the back and murder the last of their supply lines. Even if the Heroes got some bullshit second wind, what the fuck can they do against The Woe backed by a FULL army? > > Win? No! If that were the case why haven't we seen a single overlord heroic Named? Why does the Grey Pilgrim need an army to wage war against Praes? Why doesn't he simply walk by himself into Ater and topple the tower? Or the Saint, for all her bullshit holy war mantra? > > Conservation of Ninjutsu demands they'd both come out victorious, no? Two Old Veterans standing against the approaching Darkness wreathed in Light ONE last time. Fucking hells they'd even have a Story of it. So why haven't they done that yet? > > The only reason I can conceive is that for all the heroic second wind bullshit, the dickheads above have limits to what extent they can interfere. Keyword being LIMITS. > > Again, they're not invulnerable, they're not invincible. They can bleed. They can die. So kill them. KILL THEM ALL! The BLOOD GOD DEMANDS SACRIFICE!! >> **u/18scsc** [+23] (9 hours later) >> >> Except those Dread Emperors you mention always die. >> >> This world runs on narrativium, and these heroes are numerous and powerful. She might beat the odds and whipe them out, but the heavens cheat and someone will rise from the dead with a powerup or some other BS deus ex machina will go off and Cat will end up dead. She'll manage to kill all but one, or she'll manage to kill them all but still lose as a Hero sacrifices themselves to defeat the evil queen. >> >> The more the Good v Evil narrative is enforced, the worse Cat is fucked. The more it's undercut the stronger Cat is. Playing too much hardball during negotiations enforces that narrative. The more Cat tries to de-escalate, the less people she kills, the weaker that narrative becomes. >>> **u/TheEngineer923** [+1] (16 hours later) >>> >>> "Except those Dread Emperors you mention always die." >>> >>> They die because they don't deign to make lasting reforms that will survive them, instead embracing their stupid Bond Villain philosophy. They also die because they're surrounded by scheming assholes that live on a bullshit Klingon promotion philosophy. >>> >>> Black and Malicia are living proof that villains can last long enough to bring about lasting reforms and Cat was a direct pupil of the Knight. My main point in Cat killing them all is to make Cordelia realize that Callow is not a country to be fucked with. Cat forgot one of Black's cardinal lessons in that you never negotiate from a position of weakness. She'd have an easier time getting Cordelia to sign the accords if she breaks the spine of this Crusade and then takes an oath that she would not invade Procer and would provide assistance to the Principate should the Dead King make a return or any of the other forces of Evil. After that's dealt with she can begin implementing lasting reforms that would survive her. >>> >>> Regarding the Deus Ex Machina, need I remind you that Triumphant and Black have killed a lot of heroic monsters? For all their second wind bullshit they are NOT immortal OR invincible! This is added to the fact that Cat is not even truly a villain! Her Name is weak enough to be non-existent (and Squire is by default a Neutral Name) and unless she delves deep into Winter she doesn't even have a Role so to speak. So she can neatly sidestep all the bullshit stories because remember, stories only care about Named and they don't apply to mundane plebs or "others". >>> >>> So all those Deus Ex Machina shit you talked about Black undoubtedly already knows and knowing the Carrion Lord he has a plan to deal with that. >>> >>> "She'll manage to kill all but one, or she'll manage to kill them all but still lose as a Hero sacrifices themselves to defeat the evil queen." >>> >>> Evil? Is defending your homeland from invaders by killing them all Evil? In what sense is that Evil? Let's not forget who threw the first fucking stone here. Cat in no way provoked Procer. She even offered the Pilgrim free fast travel directly to the REAL capital Evil country but he refused out some bullshit principle. She made every single reasonable concession to avoid bloodshed but the other side are being obstinate assholes. This Story is NOT about heroes heroically venturing forward to liberate a country so they DON'T have the narrative weight. And as I said, raise the dead army to decimate the Proceran forces and have Thief whisper to the mercenaries that there's better pay and less death fighting on Callow's side. For all their powers the Heroes would not be able to stand against an army backed by three Named and the last titled Fae Noble. Replenish the ranks with the dead and mercenaries. Meet up with Hakram and Kegan and join Black at Vale and kick Klaus Pappenheim's teeth in. >>> >>> But that's the fun thing to do. Let's rather do the boring thing and try to negotiate with the assholes who broke into your house, screwed your wife, broke your flat screen and had the nerve to tell you it's your fault. That is imminently more reasonable. >>>> **u/18scsc** [+8] (a day later) >>>> >>>> This is a **Practical** Guide to Evil, not a Fun Guide to Evil and personally, I like reading about the diplomacy and politics. Also I'm not just speculating and making shit up here either. From Cat herself >>>> >>>> >I wasn’t sure what Akua’s plan had been but it hardly mattered. While it looked like she might have been getting the better of the fight with the heroes, fighting them at all was a mistake as far as I was concerned. Even if I killed a few they’d still get me in the end. >>>> >>>> You're not entirely wrong though, there are plenty of reasons to think Cat and Co might be able to beat the Heroes. However there are also plenty of unknowns and a heavy element of chance. Cat could very well best the Heroes, but it's an inherently risky proposition and its just as possible she'll lose. >>>> >>>> Maybe you just see her as a character in a book, but from her own perspective she is a person who doesn't want to risk death if she doesn't have to. The Woe are her friends not just combat assets. An all out battle puts them at risk. Furthermore it puts Callow at risk. >>>> >>>> But here's the clincher: >>>> >>>> The longer the ceasefire, the more she negotiates in good faith, the weaker the Good v Evil narrative gets and the better the chances of Cat winning if everything does go to shit. Secondly, the Procean army is out of food and so the longer this ceasefire lasts the weaker the enemy army gets. >>>> >>>> Simply put, even if negotiations fail Cat will still have gained relative advantage. >>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [+2] (a day later) >>>>> >>>>> And that's what she'll do. Neato. >>>> **u/cyberdsaiyan** [+6] (22 hours later) >>>> >>>> Yeah well, the problem is that if said spine is broken Hasenbach loses any reason to negotiate. Levantine armies will be joining them, who will be *livid* with rage if their Grey Pilgrim is dead. And remember this - No man/woman rules alone. Just as the high lords act as a sort of counterbalance to the tower's power, the princes supporting Hasenbach will not hesitate to turn on her if she comes off as weak. >>>> >>>> What happens if Cat just "kills them all"? Well all prospects of long term peace with Procer (which is a small part of what she wants btw) goes straight out the window. >>>> >>>> Why would Cat do something that would destroy the culmination of *years* of her work and planning? >>>> >>>> "But Hasenbach would realise that Callow is not a country to be fucked with, so she'll sue for peace." >>>> >>>> ... is not what is going to happen. If Hasenbach attempted that, she would immediately be overthrown by less reasonable princes and Cat will have a fight to the death with the entirety of Procer and the Levant (which will greatly appreciated by *Malicia* by the way, who you've seem to have forgotten the existence of). >>>> >>>> Oh, sure, she might even *win* that fight. But then she just becomes another card carrying villain, who will eventually be overthrown. Black and Malicia, for all their ruthlessness, only have the fear they inflict to protect their precious institutions. I have no doubt that the next dread emperor/empress who comes along will gut the reforms and cause the downfall of Praes proportional to their victory. Cat wants the shit the does to survive *past* her. Hell she even considered abdication as an option and seriously considered whether it would have more merits. >>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [+0] (a day later) >>>>> >>>>> Three words: Dark Day Protocols. >>>>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+4] (a day later) >>>>>> >>>>>> How does that help? >>>>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [-1] (a day later) >>>>>>> >>>>>>> It will kill everything >>>>>>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+7] (a day later) >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> How does *that* help? >>>>>>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [-2] (a day later) >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> "No man. No problem." >>>>>>>>> -Joseph Stalin >>>>>>>>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+6] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I don't think Cat, even after shedding so much of her humanity, is so much of a monster that she'd see "genocide everywhere but Callow" as an acceptable solution. If she goes that route, the *best* possible outcome is that the Gods Above cheat to get her dead before she can pull the trigger. I mean, she's a person, not a value-maximizing AI willing to commit literally any atrocity to achieve her goal of an independent Callow. >>>>>>>>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [-1] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Ah, that pesky humanity thing again. So droll. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Just think of how much fun you could have if you just put ya middle finger to everything and embrace the role of Evil. Look at Kyros, he gets it. Sure those darn tootin heroes would eventually kick your ass but if you do it well, like Triumphant (may she return), you will be able to seriously ruin Procer's shit. Levant too, when they come bitching about their beloved Pilgrim. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Though she doesn't know it yet, if Levant and the rest of the continent take arms against her she'd have the backing of the entire Free Cities under the effective rule of the Tyrant of Helike. Sure he'd backstab her down the line but hey, omelette and eggs. And hey, you might even get resurrected, like Dread Emperor Revenant before you. It even works with the whole Callowan grudge thing. "Not even Death will stop me from having my revenge!" For MORE fun! >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> So come on Cat, throw common sense to the wind and teach Calernia to fear Callow... >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> ... But you won't do that, will you? It doesn't jive with the reasons you took power, does it? You need motivation. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Don't worry. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I'm sure the Saint will give you ample motivation soon enough, like a dead member of The Woe. Or Juniper. I wonder then, once you've lost someone that close to you and not just the thousands of nameless mooks, if you'd still want to negotiate peace. I wonder if you'd be able to shut up and multiply then. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Because it is said that when we are in most need of our art, is the time when we're the most likely to forget it... >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Here's hoping I get to find out soon... >>>>>>>>>>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+9] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> This is...really edgy. I can't tell if you're being flippant or not. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Personally I'd rather read a story about a person struggling to succeed at an ambitious cause without abandoning all her principles or sabotaging that same cause in the long term, as opposed to a story about a living wrecking ball gleefully ruining everyone's shit until some hero finally puts her down like a rabid animal. Tyrant is fun, but there's a reason he's not the main character. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I'm also not really following the bit about how losing a loved one should make Cat *more* inclined to murder a shitload of other people's loved ones. You want her to "shut up and multiply," but only with respect to her own side? "The death of my loved one has driven home that all of my nameless mooks were real people with hopes and dreams and loved ones of their own. Fuck Procer for killing them! I'm gonna kill all of *their* nameless mooks, and their nameless civilians too!" >>>>>>>>>>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [+0] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I can neither confirm nor deny that I am being flippant. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> In the immortal words of a certain professor "Killing idiots is my great joy in life and I'd thank you for not speaking ill of it until you try it yourself." In that vein, give being a wrecking ball gleefully ruining people's shit until you get shot by the cops a try before you knock it. Assuming you survive the encounter of course, teeheehee... >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Well I'd rather read that kind of story and the sequel where the dog returns from hell with three heads and breathing frozen fire... >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> But I guess that is not up to either of us, as well as it should. It's in the hands of EE. Let's see where he takes us, shall we? Should be a treat whatever happens... >>>>>>>>>>>>>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+9] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> I feel like you're trying to do some kind of smirking anime voice in your comments and it's really weirding me out. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> **u/TheEngineer923** [+0] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hmm >>>>>>>>>>>> **u/18scsc** [+6] (a day later) >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Buddy, if that's what you want you're probably reading the wrong story. It's more than just creating strong institutions that got Black and Malicia this far. It's also not doing stupid shit such as acting like a stereotypical Villian of the old breed. >> **u/RynnisOne** [+3] (9 hours later) >> >> Blood for the Blood God. >> >> Honestly, I rather agree, we're it not for the fact that she claims she's trying to prevent further loss of life. >> >> Still, them saying they can't negotiate in good faith means all of this talk is meaningless. >> >> I'm seriously surprised she hasn't employed a Scry and Die strategy at this point. For all the talk of assassination teams using portals to kill enemy monarchs and generals being seen as a major threat, using it on the battlefield seems to be common sense. Use Masego and the Observatory to locate heroes than can be ambushed or abducted (or their bodies taken, at least, so they can be disposed of with goblin fire). Use your portals (in quick "tied off" forms) to create murder holes in space through which your allies (or remaining repeating siege engine, or Archer) can launch attacks. Oh, the heroes might be able to turn this around? Fine, use it to pick off the sergeants and captains. That'll cause more chaos in the enmy ranks anyway. >> >> Her not knowing Saints location is criminal. Oh, they have a set range you can't put a scrying sensor? Put one ABOVE and use it as a spotter. Or just have some dedicated goblins with spyglasses keeping track of Hero movements on the battlefield. >> >> Cat is using her powers fairly poorly right now, but more annoyingly, she is not using her brain very well. I can only hope it is part of a cunning plot waiting to be revealed. There are enough characters whose actions are hidden from us that this is quite possible. >>> **u/CeruleanTresses** [+8] (12 hours later) >>> >>> >Still, them saying they can't negotiate in good faith means all of this talk is meaningless. >>> >>> They said they couldn't negotiate in good faith under the terms of "negotiations between the Kingdom of Callow and the...invading army." Which was their polite way of initiating the haggling session that ended with the "Queen in Callow and mandated expeditionary force" compromise. They weren't declaring a refusal to negotiate in good faith *at all,* just pushing for a concession on the "invading army" language, which would have put them at a disadvantage right off the bat. >>> >>> As for the rest--the whole point of this arc is that Cat is trying to achieve her goals without resorting to the kind of villainous escalation that will, per narrative logic, fuck her and Callow over in the long run. If she wants to restore Callow as a lasting, functional kingdom that won't fall apart when she dies, she has to work within the system to an extent. > **u/CouteauBleu** [-4] *We are the Empire.* (2 hours later) > > Ugh, this is cool stuff, but we're getting to it too slowly. WHY CAN'T YOU UPDATE 5 TIMES A WEEK, AUTHOR? >> **u/None** [+2] (14 hours later) >> >> create a patreon and donate to him, if more people pays more chapters will be available >>> **u/Jangri-** [+4] (a day later) >>> >>> I don't think much more than 3 chapters a week is feasible while also keeping some level of quality >>>> **u/None** [+1] (a day later) >>>> >>>> it depends, he could take and hiatus and use it to create a buff which would allow him to publish more times per week without sacrificing the quality >>> **u/cyberdsaiyan** [+2] (23 hours later) >>> >>> he already [has one](https://www.patreon.com/user?u=3523924). >>>> **u/None** [+3] (a day later) >>>> >>>> I know I was telling him to join, I did not get the joke >>> **u/CouteauBleu** [+1] *We are the Empire.* (22 hours later) >>> >>> I was kidding. >>>> **u/None** [+1] (a day later) >>>> >>>> I guess that's whoosh for me then jajaja >>>> **u/mojojo46** [+1] (a day later) >>>> >>>> I'm afraid sarcasm is dead, especially on the internet. :( >>>> >>>> For what it's worth, it was pretty obvious to me that you were making a light-hearted joke to show appreciation of the story, but it seems that many people did not get this... >>>>> **u/CouteauBleu** [+1] *We are the Empire.* (a day later) >>>>> >>>>> Appreciated. ---