## Looking for Rationalist Fiction

* Author: u/None *
* URL: https://www.reddit.com/r/rational/comments/9f75tb/looking_for_rationalist_fiction/
* Score: 4

* Created: 2018-09-12T12:09:01

### Post:

I'm looking for rational**ist** fiction. To prevent ambiguity over what that is, I'll state explicitly what I think constitutes rationalist fiction:   
   
1. Demonstration of rationalist techniques as applied to optimising the world (this includes but is not limited to: cognitive biases, Bayesian epistemology, decision/game theory, use of psychology, anything discussed on Lesswrong, etc).   
2. Teaching of said rationalist techniques to the reader (as seen in e.g HPMOR).   
    
The above two are IMO the two main characteristics of rationalist fiction. A work that satisfies at least one of them usually qualifies (though it may need to be evaluated on a case by case basis). Fics I read and think aren't rationalist (but are rational) though others may disagree on:   

* A Practical Guide to Evil.  
* Mother of Learning (I still love it though).   

Actually, I've put MOL on hiatus since January (to stockpile chapters), so I may be off a bit in my diagnosis.   
    
######Restrictions    
I would like to not see the following recommendations:   

* Harry Potter/HPMOR fanfiction.   
* Fanfiction that requires me to have read the source material for the best experience.   
* I hated The Waves Arisen (please keep that in mind).   
* I hate character bashing (related to the above), and if it's a franchise whose source material I know, if the fanfic mistreats canon characters I would probably drop it (please keep in mind Re: Naruto fanfiction).    
* Works less than 100 K words.   

     
Rationalist Fiction I Loved:   

* HPMOR.  
* The Metropolitan Man.   
* Luminosity (so far).  
* Shoulders of Giants.  
* I can't think of anything else.   
    
Thanks for your time, and please give me recs along with a synopsis and why you think I would love it.

### Comments:

> **u/Sophronius** [+8]  *The Need to Become Stronger* (7 hours later)
> 
> Since you mentioned Naruto, my own [The Need to Become Stronger](https://needtobecomestronger.wordpress.com/2016/10/17/chapter-1/) (soon to be continued) might qualify, although some readers have characterized the very first chapter as bashing Sasuke. The general consensus seems to be that the action scenes provide very satisfying intellectual payoff, since there's a lot of prep work that goes into munchkining techniques in order to overcome impossible odds.
> 
> Most of the rationalist lessons are implicit rather than explicit though, since I don't really like author tracts, so don't expect too many lectures where characters outright explain rationalist teachings. When characters do lecture, it's usually because they have something world-specific that needs to be explained, like in this scene:
> 
> >“The mental  aptitude that’s needed for genjutsu is the ability to think at multiple  levels,” Kakashi explained mid-leap. “If you just attack an enemy  head-on that’s called first level thinking, while second level is if  they anticipate your attack and set up a counter in advance. Third level  is if you see their counterattack coming and think of a way to prevent  it, and so on and so forth. The first rule of strategy is that you  should always try to play one level higher than your opponent. The  second rule is that everybody always plays at second level, and so  should you.”  
> >  
> >“*Second*  level?” Naruto spluttered, wind whipping through his hair as he  struggled to keep up with his teacher’s impossibly fast jumps. “But, if  everybody *knows* that, then…”  
> >  
> >“Then  nothing,” Kakashi said as he leaped to the next roof. “It doesn’t matter  what level other people play at, because cleverness is still going to  get you killed. Technically, the real second rule is that you should use  the simplest possible strategy that can be made to work, so the worse  the situation you’re in the cleverer you’re allowed to be. But you’re  not supposed to ever get in a situation like that in the first place, so  it amounts to the same thing in practice.”
> 
> ​

>> **u/None** [+2]  (14 hours later)
>> 
>> I'll add it to the list. I actually forgot about it (slow updates meant I didn't keep up with it I guess, and it wasn't that memorable among the thousands of Naruto fanfic I read. At any rate, I'm glad you're continuing, and please don't stop).

> **u/ArgentStonecutter** [+4]  *Emergency Mustelid Hologram* (13 minutes later)
> 
> Alicorn, "Dogs".
> 
> Much of Greg Egan's work, such as "Mr. Volition".

>> **u/None** [+2]  (3 hours later)
>> 
>> I like Luminosity so I'll check "Dogs" out. Link for the rest?

>>> **u/ArgentStonecutter** [+1]  *Emergency Mustelid Hologram* (3 hours later)
>>> 
>>> I don't know what of Egan's work is online, check gregegan.net.

>>>> **u/None** [+2]  (3 hours later)
>>>> 
>>>> Can you give me titles? I'll search Libgen.

>>>>> **u/ArgentStonecutter** [+3]  *Emergency Mustelid Hologram* (3 hours later)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Mister Volition is the best I can think of. But seriously check his site it's got all his works that are online plus he seriously does the math.

---