36 KiB
[BST][Spoilers] Rational!Frozen
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Author: u/AmeteurOpinions Finally, everyone was working together.*
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URL: https://www.reddit.com/r/rational/comments/1w14i4/bstspoilers_rationalfrozen/
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Score: 14
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Created: 2014-01-24T13:40:22
Post:
My gears have been turning ever since I saw the movie, but I haven't written everything down till now. This fic is extremely likely to crossover with Tangled, and IIRC there was a reference to Tangled within Frozen, so those movies fit together perfectly. Commence walls of text.
WARNING: I AM ASSUMING YOU HAVE SEEN DISNEY'S FROZEN AND WILL SPOIL A GREAT MANY THINGS ABOUT THE MOVIE.
My power flurries through the air into the ground
My soul is spiralling in frozen fractals all around
And one thought crystallizes like an icy blast
I'm never going back, the past is in the past
Part One: Power
So anyway, Frozen gives one of the most exploitable powers ever to Elsa. Not only does the ice possess near-perfect interpretation of intent and incredible precision (from palaces to freaking fabric) but also enables intelligent drones which can be tailored to any purpose.
It is uncertain if the "ice" generated by this power is actually water or some sort of water analogue. It is uncertain if the water is potable, as pure H2O harmful to drink. A great deal of influence on existing water is generated, as when Elsa froze the entire water supply with a handful of footsteps.
The ice is certainly sturdy enough for building construction, and the precision of creating it can create simple mechanical devices, such as hinges.
I'm going to talk about the snowmen for a bit. We have two examples, Olaf, and an unnamed giant I'll call "Guardian."
Olaf gets the most screen time, so lets start with him. His creation is the most interesting aspect, as Elsa formed him off-hand, almost accidentally, and was surprised to discover he was intelligent and animated. Olaf is perfectly sentient, wide a significant range of emotions and installed education. I am uncertain to the degree of his senses, but he can speak, feel, see and hear perfectly well, despite lacking complex structures to do so. He is, aside from melting, functionally immortal, provided his is reassembled afterward. He quickly recovers from partial melting. There is no case of restoring a snowman which has completely melted and refrozen.
It must also be noted that Olaf interacts with wooden limbs attached to him. These stop animation if they are removed [Disproved], but their shape does not revert.
The Guardian is significantly different. It is much larger, but its construction occurred almost as quickly as Olaf's despite the size difference. It too, is capable of speech, and adapted for combat with articulated fingers and reinforced joints. The Guardian demonstrares an ability to improve itself in battle (development of spikes after being shot by a crossbow, etc.), though it is uncertain if this is an instinctive response to injury or a conscious decision to escalate the conflict. The limits of these evolutions are uncertain. The Guardian's snow-based components were weak, but those problems are solvable.
Both of these creations must have been, considering Elsa's emotional state at the current time, totally unplanned. There is no known limit on the potential number of snowmen, or on their size or characteristics (a Serpent would be super cool, honestly).
Elsa's power is affected by her emotional state. The distinctions are fuzzy, but her control decreases as her ability to focus does, which is compounded by stress.
The last important note is that Elsa got her powers by birth, which means that there could easily be others with similar powers elsewhere in the world.
Part Two: Emotion
Now that we've established a decent baseline, I want to bring something up.
What often happens in a Rationalist/Deconstructionist fanfiction of a "fairy tale" story is that things like the magical power of true love get broken down or shown to be false, with some other alternative presented.
Why?
Why can't love have magic powers? Like actual, true power sourced from love. Why can't emotions have tangible physical effects in a world where magic has tangible physical effects?
The problems with those fairy tale is that "True Love" as a narrative device has tended towards unsatisfactory/inconsistent conflict resolution. I propose that this is a failure of the storyteller and not the narrative device itself. I want to see a story where True Love, just like everything else in a Rational story, is taken seriously, with all of the logical implications of a world where such forces exist. To the logical extremes!
Thusly, "Love" is a global magical effect which distributes along relationships between sentient beings. It does not directly cause these relationships to form, but will have certain influences as they do. Variances will occur between two kids who have been in love for an hour and two adults who've been together for fifty years. This will definitely be the trickiest part to design.
Part Three: Story
There are exactly two things I would like to change about Frozen: replace those silly trolls with the original ice gatherers from the prologue, with a single shaman to provide the magical elements (it's actually better that way, giving at least one other case of a human being born with magic) and I would change the ending. Slightly.
Anna succumbs to the ice and freezes. Her forzen hand blocks Han's sword, KOing him and saving Elsa's life. This act of sacrifical love thaws Elsa's heart, disabling her magic and changing her hair color back to the darker color her mother had. This (Elsa's power block) in combination with Anna's own Sacrifice saves Anna's life, returning her to normal. The ice holding up Anna, Elsa and Hans breaks down, but Christoff and Sven save the girls from drowning. Olaf melts as Arrendale normalizes, unfortunately.
This reselling would form the first chapter, leaving the fic as such:
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Arrendale is in chaos from the catastrophic snowstorms, the summer crop of the entire region has been obliterated and the death counts are just coming in...
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The Duke of
WeaseltownWesselton is readying to manipulate trade systems and relief efforts for the stricken kingdom... -
The Southern Isles are threatening retaliation for political reasons (Han's death is just an excuse for his older brothers to make a power grab)...
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There's probably a rebellion of magic-haters brewing somewhere, possibly with aid from the Duke...
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The Winter has attracted the attention of at least two extremely dangerous magic users from abroad (still deciding what they would be)...
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Anna and Elsa have been reunited after a childhood of seperation and memory abuse, and must now catch up while leading the kingdom through a combination of crises.
'Cause for the first time in forever,
I finally understand
For the first time in forever,
We can fix this hand in hand
And that's what I have so far. Comment if you have anything to add or if I made a mistake. And now that I think about it, this would probably start to spiral out into deconstructing most of the Disney versions of fairy tales, although I expect that has been tried before. Does anyone know of anything like that?
Comments:
u/None [+7] (an hour later)
Great idea! I have a compulsive desire to rewrite every movie I watch, and Frozen is definitely rife with possibilities for rationality.
Ooh, a deconstructionist fic. I really like your ideas thus far. Are you planning on setting it in the same universe as Tangled? Just because that would be kinda cool.
Anyway, looking forward to reading it. If there are already deconstructionist Disneyfics, then I've not seen them; you'd be the first! Awesome!
In case you were wondering, btw, the giant guardian snowman is named Snowflake.
u/None [+5] (2 hours later)
Frozen is a prime candidate for exploring rationality. It has interesting characters, exploitable powers, an implied wider world around it...
And it's overlap with Tangled is canon. Rapunzel and Eugene were at the coronation.
In case you were wondering, btw, the giant guardian snowman is named Snowflake.
I thought it was Marshmellow. A leaflet in a Kinder Egg told me.
u/None [+5] (2 hours later)
Of course, if OP was feeling creative, he'd do a fullblown How to Freeze Your Brave Tangled Guardian... Too much?
u/TastyBrainMeats [+3] (2 hours later)
Rise of the Guardians would be very tricky to fit in, since it shows a modern setting, but damn if I wouldn't love to see an AU Jack meet Elsa.
u/None [+2] (8 hours later)
I've actually been playing around with a rational!Guardians AU where it's set in the late 900s or thereabouts. Just cos. Probably just a one-shot, but I definitely left room to expand ...
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (2 hours later)
The problem is that I'd have to spend a lot more time for every setting I added.
u/None [+2] (5 days later)
This has nothing to do with the comment I'm replying to, but this is awesome and should be thought about.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (5 days later)
Heh, that was pretty good.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+2] Finally, everyone was working together. (2 hours later)
It's not an outright deconstruction, unless taking something seriously is the only requirement to calling something a deconstruction.
u/None [+2] (a day later)
Taking for-granted story elements to their realistic conclusions, which were ignored in the original fic? Yeah, sounds like a deconstruction.
u/LordSwedish [+6] Q Continuum (2 hours later)
This is very interesting and I like the idea of love as an quantifiable effect and further exploration in snow based AI. The main problem I have with the idea is how Elsa's power is disabled.
This act of sacrificial love thaws Elsa's heart, disabling her magic
It is clearly stated in the movie that it is a gift rather than a curse and that the only reason why the power is a bad thing is that Elsa fears and fights it. I understand if you want to remove the power "at least temporarily" for story purposes but in that case it should be a mental block due to the trauma rather than a "curse lifted" scenario. It also doesn't fit with the fact that Elsa's heart "froze" due to isolation, trauma and stress and it was quite "thawed" when the sisters were children even though she had her magic then.
Another idea is that the snow golems could have some kind of core made of ice and magic that works as a heart and brain for them. This would also be easy to work in with the power of love as well as give a way for Elsa to still use some of her power. Perhaps Olafs or the guardians core is recovered and because it's fused with some of her power she can use it in some way.
Anyway, I hope some of my ideas helped and I look forward to reading the story once you start putting it out there.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (2 hours later)
a mental block due to trauma rather than a "curse lifted" scenario
That's pretty much what I was planning. My problem with the movie is that the resolution was too simple; Elsa was just like "oh right, love" and then fixed everything instantly. A very big part of the magic system would come down to the difference between the heart and the brain.
u/LordSwedish [+2] Q Continuum (2 hours later)
Yeah the ending definitely needs changing for a good story to come from it. I was just worried that it would play out more in the way that "and the love (read, good) made her lose her power (read, bad)" rather than "and the significant trauma of seeing her sister who she supposedly killed dying for real to protect her caused her to lose her power."
u/None [+7] (6 hours later)
I liked how rationally they treated the Power of Love in the movie, actually. Once they found out that's what Anna needed, it was all like, "Get me to the man with the kissing powers!" as if the Power of Love is just another element in their world like penicillin is in ours. Expanding on that would be really interesting.
u/None [+4] (11 hours later)
Well thank god that's not how they actually did it; that would've been so cheesy and antifeminist I'd've died. The sisterly love thing was much much better.
u/Suitov [+1] The Culture (19 days later)
Yup, I loved how thoroughly that was deconstructed.
u/None [+4] (6 hours later)
God dammit, I'm already writing this. I want to change a bunch of things, most notably Hans turning out to be a villain (as much as it makes the "Love is an Open Door" song delightful to relisten to. "We finish all of each other's--" "Sandwiches!" "That's what I was going to say!" No you weren't.), and address the question of just what the hell were Elsa and Anna doing for ~ten years locked up in a castle and not talking to each other. I also want to put in a lot of the missing elements from the original story the movie is every so loosely based off of. Especially the witch and her flowers and the thief girl with the knife.
Then there's the question of what happens after the movie ending. Elsa's military power is ridiculous, and the other countries would notice. I'd also like for the sisters to learn a Very Important Lesson about why it's a bad idea to cut off trade with another country just because their duke is a jerk.
And of course there's the question of where Elsa's power comes from, which bothered me the whole movie. If they had just said, "An ice fairy blessed her" one minute in it would have been fine, but they don't explain at all.
Anyone else think the movie was overrated? It was good but not great. The songs were fun but forgettable. Elsa was the main character and needed more screen time and more focus on her arc. This is not yet the second Disney renaissance that some people are calling it. Also, the faces for their female leads really bother me. The faces are too wide and the noses too small and pushed down. And the clumpy hair makes me feel ill for some reason.
u/None [+2] (7 hours later)
Since you're both coming at this from a completely different direction, I think there's room for more than one rational exploration of Frozen. And I approve of changing Hans to not be a villain. It really bothered me that the most competent person was the bad guy.
Anyone else think the movie was overrated? It was good but not great.
It was pretty great, actually but just like every other Disney movie, you can't overthink it too much. Otherwise Aladin becomes a bad movie :-) The animation was amazing, the songs were fun (especially "Do You Want to Build a Snowman" and "Let it Go") and the characters were rather fun. And amazingly Olaf wasn't completely annoying.
The movie did have flaws, but so has nearly every movie. But during my first time watching it, I was emotionally engaged (even tearing up a little), I laughed, I gasped, I was amazed by the cool ice powers... And the story being about sisterly love is another plus.
I guess it depends on how you rate a movie. For me, a movie (or any story, really) is good if I'm emotionally engaged and don't spend too much time questioning it while watching it.
u/None [+1] (9 hours later)
Well, I wasn't planning on doing a rationalist take per se exactly anyway. Consistent world building and intelligent people and actions having consequences isn't quite the same as rationalist fiction.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (9 hours later)
It is (according to the sidebar, anyway).
u/None [+1] (13 hours later)
As someone open to suggestions – what, then, do you think are some qualities of rationalist fiction?
u/None [+2] (a day later)
I guess I just get the feeling that anyone who wants to write basically intelligent or even just non-shit fanfiction is going to call their work rationalist fiction because where the hell else are you going to find a community of people who like intelligent non-shit fanfiction?
Rationalist fiction seems to me to imply more than intelligent characters lacking in idiot balls or a basically internally consistent world where everything that's happening should actually make sense according to consistent rules. These things are just good writing and should show up in stories that in no way aspire to be rationalist fiction.
Rationalist fiction shouldn't even have to contain these qualities in principle. Rationality is the same for stupid people as it is for smart people, after all, and a world that doesn't have exploitable, consistent rules for a rationalist to learn, master, and abuse could still be a rationalist fic. That would be quite the challenge. It's not much proof of one's rationality to pass trials that have already been passed, no?
Basically I would say rationalist fiction consists of rational characters doing things for rational reasons. They shouldn't need to be smart, and the world shouldn't need to be full of dumb for them to point out, exploit, and correct. Although those qualities can make a story much more fun.
So the Korra fic I'm writing, for example, isn't rationalist fic even though it has some smart characters, internally consistent rules, and plenty of world-building because the main characters aren't rational. They're not idiots (well, Korra is), but they'll make all the typical mistakes humans in their situation tend to do, and no one's going to go on a rant about how they're doing everything prectibably wrong. Reversing that last quality seems to me to be what sets rationalist fiction apart from simply stories that don't have idiot balls, or stories that that advance the anti-death worldview, etc. Also I suppose to some extent it's a matter of degree.
In any case, I don't know why everyone's in such a rush to write rationalist fiction. HPMOR's and HP&N20 are made extra-fun by watching rational characters kick ass and teach important lessons, but what really makes this stories work is an engaging plot and characters. Without them, HPMOR would just be a guy trying to teach brain lessons in a fun way, and HP&N20 would just be a guy pointing out how exploitable D&D rules are (which I don't play). I mean, seriously, who wants to write genre fiction, for crying out loud?
Although someone needs to write anti-rationalist fiction where the main character learns about tacit and local knowledge, and, more importantly, learns about the importance of social skills and how in real life, adults aren't going to quietly submit to the sarcastic rants of children. A really rationalist character would treat charisma and social skills as if they're brain-hacking and master them accordingly.
u/None [+3] (a day later)
I've tried to type this several times but, as usual, I'm proving awkward with translating my thoughts into words. This hits at my main points; not perfect, but it'll have to do until I think of some better way. If/when that happens.
It seems to me like the major problem I find with how you're thinking about this is highlighted in the following sentence:
I mean, seriously, who wants to write genre fiction, for crying out loud?
You're thinking of rationalist fiction as a genre, when it's really a trope. It's something we find in works of different genres. And for that reason, yes rationalist fiction is "simply" stories that don't have idiot balls and have consistent laws of reality.
You say that
These things are just good writing and should show up in stories that in no way aspire to be rationalist fiction.
That's right! What author aspires to use a trope? You'll notice that a huge percentage of works we share in this subreddit weren't intended by their authors to be "rational" or anything like that. And, well, not everyone shares that definition of "good writing", as a cursory survey of best-rated books should reveal. So all we're doing here is giving a succinct name to the set of tropes we find desirable – eg, as you pointed out, no random Idiot Balls and a consistent universe.
A piece of writing being "rational" isn't placing it in a genre, it's the implementation of a trope. And for that reason, yes your Legend of Korra fic absolutely belongs in this subreddit. I look forward to seeing your posting of future chapters!
^Also, ^considering ^that ^we ^as ^a ^community ^were ^part ^of ^the ^worldbuilding, ^I'm ^trying ^not ^to ^be ^insulted ^that ^you ^didn't ^deign ^to ^inform ^us ^when ^you ^updated, ^whether ^or ^not ^it ^seemed ^rational ^to ^you. ^:(
u/None [+1] (a day later)
But absence of idiot balls and consistent rules is just good writing and you'll see it in quite a lot of fiction that in no way fits the tone of rationalist fiction.
Or, to put it another way, what would your TV Tropes entry for 'Rationalist' look like? Is it a character trope? A plot trope? A milieu trope? What's the entry say? (Someone should do this anyway if it doesn't already exist)
I see rationalist fiction as two things:
- A story featuring characters who have an explicit understanding that the world works in certain predictable ways and choose to exploit the hell out of those rules. They think in ways that are very different from the way normal people think, but it works because it's rational (actually, that's backwords: it's rational because it works). HJPEV, Milo, etc.
and/or
- Fiction that promotes transhumanism, lifeism, etc. This is more like "rationalist movement" fiction than rationalist fiction per se, since it could just as easily be a story about people who have no particular rationality skills.
I guess I worry that "rationalist fiction" could easily slide into any kind of story that has characters who don't do really dumb things all the time unless those dumb things are related to social skills in which case there won't be any real consequences anyway and who are into science and Explaining Things and going "Whaaa that makes no sense I must do science and explain teh magic." Ultra geeky science fiction in a fantasy setting that takes its magic system way too seriously /=/ rationalist fiction, IMO.
Which is why I'm not updating my LoK story here since it definitely doesn't fit my definition of rationalist fiction. Although yeah, you guys did help me and I did kind of forget about that, so sorry.
u/None [+2] (a day later)
Have you seen the sidebar? That list of characteristics is the product of a discussion from /r/HPMOR. That's what a TV Tropes page would look like.
I have a quick critique, and that's that you keep mentioning HPN20 as a rationalist fic. While ... Hmm, how do I say this. I wouldn't call it necessarily rationalist. If you want some textbook examples of rationalist fiction, go to HPMOR or Luminosity or Rational Death Note (whatever that's officially called). HPN20 is more deconstructionist, in that it takes for-granted elements from the Harry Potter universe to their logical extremes and sprints with it.
So when you say
A story featuring characters who have an explicit understanding that the world works in certain predictable ways and choose to exploit the hell out of those rules.
It looks more to me like a description of deconstructionist / munchkinesque (there's an excellent word, munchkinesque) fiction than rational fiction. Whereas your later quip:
Ultra geeky science fiction in a fantasy setting that takes its magic system way too seriously
Well... Let's put it this way: What part of that definition do you think something like HPMOR doesn't fulfill?
u/None [+1] (2 days later)
So if you at the sidebar,
The characters are not stupid. No one holds the Idiot Ball (or at least not the main heroes or main villains).
This is a staple of good writing.
The characters solve problems through the intelligent application of their knowledge and resources.
Maybe if "intelligent" means "abnormally creative, especially in ways that other people find horrifying, because otherwise this is also a staple of good writing. I mean, what's the alternative? A deus ex machina?
The story is like a puzzle; readers can reach the same solution as the characters by using the information provided earlier in the story.
This is a staple of the mystery and science fiction genres. Hell, people had basically solved the original Harry Potter series, and that's definitely not rationalist fiction.
Factions are defined and driven into conflict by their beliefs and values, not just by being "good" or "evil".
Another staple of good writing, albeit one that is often discarded.
The rules of the fictional world are sane and consistent.
Another staple of good writing.
So it looks like rationalist fiction basically amounts to "Well written science fiction and/or mystery stories." Which is a great genre, but I wouldn't call it particularly rationalist.
What is more likely to make something a rationalist story is that rational behavior and thought, especially as contrasted with irrational behavior and thought, plays a central role in the story. So HPMOR, HPN20 (Milo is saner than anyone), etc. Otherwise rationalist fiction seems to just be any kind of attempt to take a world's rules seriously and have a puzzle-like plot full of intelligent characters. That's is a great genre, but it isn't rationalist.
Rationality (or munchkinry, same thing) should be a primary and the defining component of rationalist fiction. Of course, it takes more than that to be a good story. A story that has all the sidebar's qualities will be a good story, but not necessarily rationalist.
u/None [+2] (2 days later)
Thank you, once again, for sharing your definition of good writing. But not everyone shares that definition, as even a cursory glance at best-rated books would reveal.
That's is a great genre, but it isn't rationalist.
Why not? You're using a supernarrow definition of rationalist fiction that nobody shares. That's just ...
I can't even continue this discussion. We're going in circles, and you seem intent on not changing your mind. I'll post new chapters of your Legend of Korra fic for you, if you won't. We don't have to reinvent the wheel, here.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+2] Finally, everyone was working together. (2 days later)
Agreed.
u/None [+1] (2 days later)
Good writing /=/ popular writing? How many people have tried to defend Twilight's prose, pacing, characterization, etc?
I think it's weird and slightly unsettling that the definition of rationalist fiction apparently is generally understood such that "rationality" is not a required attribute of "rationalist fiction" but only a "bonus".
Even given the definition on the sidebar, my LoK definitely does not fit these two:
The characters are not stupid.
The story is like a puzzle; readers can reach the same solution as the characters by using the information provided earlier in the story.
And pretty sketchy on:
The rules of the fictional world are sane and consistent.
So it still wouldn't belong on this reddit even aside from having nothing to do with rationality.
u/None [+2] (2 days later)
If this subreddit was only for fiction having to do with rationality, it would be an empty subreddit indeed. That's why we also explicitly accept not only rationalist fiction, but deconstructionist/munchkinesque fiction, and smart works of fiction in general. Regardless of whether you think it belongs here, I'm making it clear that I think it belongs here, and nobody would object to it being posted here. Is that what you're afraid of? Or is it just some moral issue?
And for the record, I'm still going to hold that worldbuilding bit over you.
u/None [+1] (2 days later)
Certainly, and I don't begrudge the creation of a reddit to fill a niche for smart fiction that makes a fetish of science and intelligence. Not being familiar with the community, I was (and will be in my head) drawing a line between fiction where rationality plays a key role in the story, and fiction that features attributes that simply happen to be popular with a community that calls itself "rationalist."
(This is typical community behavior, and for a guy who studies society, you'd think I'd see things like this coming...but I'm a social scientist, so obviously I can't predict for shit)
But still, while you can do what I want and I certainly shouldn't complain about linking to me fic since there's no point in writing it unless people read it (although I can't claim that it's a good fic), there's very little about it that fits the style, tone, and themes of most stories that get linked to here. I keep reiterating this because it really seems like my LoK fic is a bad fit for this reddit. I only linked to it here in the first place because I wanted some guidance writing a character who needs to get way stronger than she is in canon without starting out that way. But, hey, link to it. It'd be irrational of me to complain....
If you're so desperate from ratfic for me, check out the one I just linked to today, which I think both fits this reddit much better and is also a lot better written.
u/None [+1] (2 days later)
I typed up a response, but it's kinda anti-jerk so I'm going to send it to you via PM.
u/nerdguy1138 [+1] GNU Terry Pratchett (3 months later)
who is milo? i get hpjev is from hpmor. but who's Milo?
u/duffmancd [+2] (10 hours later)
(Slightly off topic) Umm, why do you think pure water is harmful to drink? All I can find on a quick google is that you may need to supplement your mineral supply and that some reverse osmosis units can get (slightly) harmful bacterial growths.
I can't think of any reasons why pure H2O would be worse than almost pure H2O, apart from the mentioned lack of trace minerals which could be made up by dietary supplements.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+2] Finally, everyone was working together. (10 hours later)
Eh, that's what I was talking about. It was more to prevent the point of Elsa making free water for the world forever.
u/Malician [+2] (a day later)
Do you think that whether the water is potable or not makes a significant difference to the effect of the power?
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (a day later)
Makes a difference of free drinking water for the world forever or not.
u/Malician [+2] (2 days later)
Mm.
But, on the other hand, the water is trivial to make drinkable either way, and, "create matter" is a cheat for "avoid heat death of the universe".
u/AmeteurOpinions [+2] Finally, everyone was working together. (2 days later)
We don't know for certain if the water is actually limitless and not simply being teleported in from planets very very very far away.
u/Malician [+1] (2 days later)
True. Thus is the crux of the matter.
u/syberdragon [+2] (17 days later)
I recall them stating several times in the film that Elsa was cursed by a witch to have her powers, or something to that affect. I could be wrong or forgetting the context of the statement.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+2] Finally, everyone was working together. (17 days later)
Nope. One of the earliest lines in the film is the chief troll asking just before he cures Anna the first time, "Born or cursed?" to which the father says "Born. And getting stronger." Elsa was certainly born that way.
u/syberdragon [+1] (17 days later)
Thanks for the clarification.
u/Suitov [+2] The Culture (20 days later)
There were several superstitious reactions along those lines, which is probably what you're remembering. Elsa was referred to as a sorceress (in a pejorative sense!) at least once by bystanders.
u/Suitov [+2] The Culture (19 days later)
Would you mind expanding on your rationale for Elsa being refrigeratored? It leaves a sour taste with me, removing her powers (that she was born with) for no reason I can see.
Please do leave Hans as a gold-digging villain, too, because it contributes to the loveliest deconstruction of the "twoo wuv at first sight" trope I've ever seen on film.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (19 days later)
The power block isn't even remotely permanent. I was working from the fact that Anna's act of True Love thawed her heart/body and Elsa's. If Elsa's power had been the result of a curse, it would have dissolved right then, but since it is a Natural Gift it was simply rattled for a day or two. The story would only take one or two chapters to restore her powers, only this time in a form which doesn't accidentally freeze the entire kingdom's water supply at the touch of a toe.
u/Suitov [+2] The Culture (19 days later)
Ah, thanks for the clarification. I'm still not sure why Elsa would need to be thawed, so much as her fear-induced mental block removed.
Y'know, the more I think about it, the more the line "Born [with the power] or cursed [with it]?" seems to be the key.
Anna's the protagonist of the film, that's clear, for example the fact that she directs the two young kids' play despite Elsa being older, and generally initiates things throughout. So I got to imagining if rational-Anna had somehow overheard (and remembered or later discovered) that titbit, and realised that some people can give people powers...
...she would probably immediately decide to learn to be a witch (or whoever it is who can curse people, can't remember if that's specified).
For me the break-point with canon could happen much earlier; I'm thinking the first time little Anna knocks on Elsa's door, and perhaps doesn't take no for an answer (driven to solve the mystery of Elsa's radically changed behaviour -- noticing she's confused by it). Realising her head's been messed with would likely be a big deal for her (mental privacy and identity being big themes in rational-fic) and, her being a child, I can imagine a "why are they punishing us both when it was an accident?" "But when I fall off my bike Mama says I have to practise so I won't fall any more..." direction of her thoughts. Leading to experimentation.
Anyhow, not to tell you what to write; that's just how my thoughts went while I was mulling the idea over last night. Still some gaps, such as how to make Elsa her own person and not just going along with things.
u/AmeteurOpinions [+1] Finally, everyone was working together. (3 minutes later)
I have no darn clue if I should try to write new songs every few chapters or not.
Edit: I mean, not like large songs. But you can certainly put snippets of "poetry" in text and have it work just fine.
u/None [+8] (2 hours later)
Only if you're really, really good at it. So (no offense) probably not.
u/None [+6] (an hour later)
Don't...
u/LordSwedish [+3] Q Continuum (2 hours later)
I think I speak for a lot of people when I say that there is one rule for songs in fanfiction. Don't do it.
u/None [+2] (6 hours later)
Do it only if you link to recordings of you singing it.