16 KiB
[Q][BST] Author of The Two Year Emperor asks: Would you fund a Patreon / Kickstarter for my writing?
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Author: u/eaglejarl *
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URL: https://www.reddit.com/r/rational/comments/2hq2at/qbst_author_of_the_two_year_emperor_asks_would/
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Score: 11
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Created: 2014-09-28T20:04:35
Post:
Please excuse the shameless plug, but I'm trying to make some life decisions and I need advice.
I've decided to move to Malaysia for a while and try to build some passive income. Best options there seem to be writing iPhone apps or writing prose. I would prefer to write prose, but I'm doing market research on both to see which is more likely to keep me from starving to death.
High fantasy feels like my forte, although I also do soft science fiction. "The Two Year Emperor" seems moderately popular, and my for-sale prequel, "One Hot Night" (</shameless_plug) has made some sales. Most likely what I would write would be prequels and sequels around "The Two Year Emperor," although they would move away from the "straight satire of D&D" and into the "original fantasy" category, because I would prefer not to end up in a lawsuit trying to convince a judge that my work is satire and therefore protected speech.
Whatever I end up writing, I intend that people can vote with their dollars to help shape the story. At various levels you would get a cameo, be allowed to introduce a minor character, or help design plot points, and probably more. I would, of course, retain final veto over all aspects of the story, but I'd work with the funders to come up with something they liked and I could do.
So, three questions for you:
- Would you fund a Patreon for my writing, at any level?
- Would you fund a Kickstarter for my writing, at any level?
- If you answered "yes" to either of the above, do you have any feeling for what level you would participate at?
Comments:
u/InternetWanderer [+7] (2 hours later)
Speaking as someone who once took an interest in living off book sales, and who has read the blogs of many professionals, I think you're going to have to keep writing as a hobby, or accept some pretty extreme lifestyle changes. No one is in this business for the money.
If you had a completed book I'd pay $10 for it. Maybe $20, if you released the first chunk as a sample and I really liked what I saw. I'm not a fan of just paying people money and waiting for them to deliver.
u/None [+4] (2 hours later)
[deleted]
u/Iconochasm [+7] (5 hours later)
He makes more than that, that's just the reliable monthly sign-ups. From something he said in a recent comment, his actual monthly income is a bit over 2k when one-off donations are counted in. His readership is also in the 6 figures (or at least was last time I saw numbers), with amazingly reliable 2.5+ long updates per week. Not an achievement that is at all easy to replicate.
u/InternetWanderer [+8] (7 hours later)
10,000 books sold = New York Times bestseller. Wildbow is doing better than most professional writers, and is an exception. Yeah, he's earned every reader he's got.
u/Nepene [+2] (a day later)
Better than most authors, earning 24k a year. Slightly below the median wage in the USA.
u/aeschenkarnos [+2] (7 hours later)
Nor is it necessarily sustainable. His readership will eventually cease to rise, then start to fall, then fall some more.
u/Iconochasm [+3] (8 hours later)
I expect it'll waffle with every new story. Hopefully, at some point ebook sales will give him a more reliable, long-term financial situation.
u/lehyde [+1] Nudist Beach (a day later)
(That link only worked for me after omitting the / at the end: http://www.patreon.com/Wildbow)
u/eaglejarl [+3] (3 hours later)
No one is in this business for the money.
I would definitely agree with that. Even Harlan Ellison made most of his money from speaking at conferences / conventions. There are people who write romances(*) who make a ton of money, and the occasional blockbuster (HP, Twilight...) exists and makes the author rich. Oh, and "50 Shades of Gray" fits in both of those categories despite the fact that almost every review I've read and every person I've spoken to says its crap. I bought it on iBooks and I'm going to read it now, just to see what I have to do to do better.
If you had a completed book I'd pay $10 for it. Maybe $20, if you released the first chunk as a sample and I really liked what I saw. I'm not a fan of just paying people money and waiting for them to deliver.
Thank you, that's good to know.
(*) Which I have no problem doing, but I don't think that fits the /r/rationalist scene and I wanted to stay mostly on topic when I posted this.
u/Nepene [+4] (an hour later)
I would fund a Patreon/Kickstarter, especially if it regularly included fans getting some degree of input in the story, like suggesting tactics and seeing them play out.
My level of funding would entirely depend on my feelings and whims on the day. £2 a month or £15 for some fixed purpose is probably my limit.
u/alexanderwales [+4] Time flies like an arrow (19 hours later)
- Probably not. I'm not big on Patreon, since I'm bad with accurately gauging monthly expenses.
- Probably yes. That depends on what the subject matter was, and how much "proof of concept" had been done.
- See above. It depends on how much the concept interests me, and how much groundwork has been done. I'd much rather Kickstart something that had already been written and was just awaiting editing/polish than something that was going to be released in weekly chapters, but that probably doesn't work for you from a monetary perspective. Amount probably depends on how I'm feeling that day, and what the reward levels are, and how long the book is projected to be, but an average of $10, which is about the price of a paperback.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Good to know, thanks.
u/Prezombie [+3] (a day later)
Patreon supports "per x updates" donations, I personally prefer them when it comes to anything with a weekly or longer update schedule. A popular model is to let patreons have a few exclusive latest chapters, and then roll them out into general availablility as you finish more.
Patreon works better for ongoing projects like serials, Kickstarter is more for getting a lump sum to to a larger project, and failure there is easy.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Thank you, this is a great idea. I'll go look at the details.
u/Escapement [+2] Ankh-Morpork City Watch (3 hours later)
I would probably not fund a patreon/kickstarter at this point in time.
I wish you the best of luck with your endeavor, but from an outsider's POV who doesn't know any details about your current finances, I think it would be very unwise to quit your day job to write for donations before you've got a sufficient revenue stream that you can support yourself. Nevertheless, good luck with whatever you decide to do!
u/eaglejarl [+2] (3 hours later)
Thank you, I really appreciate the input.
As to my finances -- I have a pretty good amount of savings, so there's a fair bit of runway under me. Also, I can probably live on <USD$1000 / month in Malasia, which makes that runway stretch even longer.
As to my day job -- I quit back in April. :) I worked for a consulting company that only had one client, and several important people at that client clearly wanted to get rid of us for political reasons. About a month after I quit, the consulting company lost its contract and everyone except 4 people (one of them the founder) were laid off.
u/Solonarv [+2] Chaos Legion (a day later)
- Yes
- Also yes
- Probably around 5 €/month on Patreon, or 25 € on Kickstarter.
All of this is on the condition that I have non-zero disposable income, which is not the case right now.
u/eaglejarl [+2] (a day later)
This is really great / flattering / uplifting to hear. Thank you!
u/LucidityWaver [+1] (3 hours later)
Yes. Depending on what's on offer, I'd go up to $35 for kickstarter and I would strongly consider making you the first person I back on Patreon. Probably a minimum $2 and a maximum $5.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (3 hours later)
Thank you! That's really flattering.
u/None [+1] (5 hours later)
Why Malaysia?
u/eaglejarl [+1] (6 hours later)
It's very cheap, you can get by in English, and it has good infrastructure (fast and reliable Internet / phones, etc). I can probably live comfortably there for <$USD1000 per month.
u/Riddle-Tom_Riddle [+1] (7 hours later)
Yes*.
Yes*.
$15, at most.
*One problem: I have to spend every dollar I have focused towards efficient survival for the foreseeable future, myself. I probably won't get into dangerous territory unless I spend too much on nonessentials. Forseeable future is 3~4 weeks at my scale.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (8 hours later)
You definitely shouldn't spend anything on my stuff until you're comfortable again, although I really appreciate the vote of interest.
I hope your finances improve soon -- money troubles suck.
u/gommm [+1] (17 hours later)
I'd probably pay about $2-$5 a month through patreon and would go up to $25 for a kickstarter... I enjoy reading your work and I think it's important to make writing prose a viable profession instead of just an hobby so I budget about $25/month to support various online writers I like.
By the way, enjoy Malaysia, I've lived for a year near penang and it's definitely a nice country to live in and it's indeed quite cheap. Only thing that's a bit frustrating is that in a lot of places internet is painfully slow albeit reliable...
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Thank you! (For both the money stuff and the Malaysia wishes.)
I'm actually looking at moving to Penang -- George Town, specifically. If you have any suggestions for things to do / things I should know, it would be much appreciated.
u/thatsciencegeek [+1] (18 hours later)
- Probably no.
- Emphatically, yes!
- ~$10, maybe $15, for a digital edition of the book.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Excellent. Thanks. Kickstarter is starting to seem like the way to go.
u/Nepene [+1] (a day later)
Have you considered doing commissions?
Suppose a member of this community absolutely had to see a really good rational horror story.
http://www.reddit.com/r/rational/comments/2hoef9/any_good_rational_horror_stories/
You could be our go to guy "Hey, this guy writes pretty good stories, you could go to him to fix a horror story if you really want."
If you wanted to turn that into passive income you could make a site or blog with a number of those stories on there, have some advertisements.
u/eaglejarl [+2] (a day later)
That's...a really good idea. I think I'll take a shot at that. It would be a lot of fun, as well as making some cash.
u/None [+1] (a day later)
I would be willing to pay maybe $1-2 per update for a serial/WIP (assuming weekly updates), and perhaps somewhere in the vicinity of $25-$35 for a completed work (assuming an average length novel). The specifics of the medium are inconsequential.
I would however prefer any projects I back to be completed or at the very least rather far along, as opposed to supporting something that might come to fruition sometime in the nebulous future.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
I would however prefer any projects I back to be completed or at the very least rather far along, as opposed to supporting something that might come to fruition sometime in the nebulous future.
By "projects you back", you mean with a one time payment, right? So, you'll fund an ongoing project with weekly drops, but probably not a Kickstarter for something that's just getting started. Yes?
u/None [+1] (a day later)
More or less, yes. It wouldn't necessarily have to be a weekly thing, but if I were to pay on a per update basis, I would expect sparser updates to be more substantial (if I were to pay more for them). I would consider funding a kickstarter for an in-the-works project. I just mean to say my willingness to do so decreases with the time left to completion (I'd have to be very impressed with a proof of concept to consider funding something that's just getting started). Also, the amount I'm willing to pay would probably be less than for a completed work.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Makes sense. Thanks for the info, and for being willing to fund me at all.
u/None [+1] (a day later)
I really enjoy reading T2YE and if anything else you write is as entertaining I will consider it money well spent. :) Good luck with everything.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (3 days later)
Thanks! (Also, if it would be money well spent, then note that One Hot Night is a thing. :>)
u/drageuth2 [+1] (a day later)
I would like to, but I'm broke. Sorry :\
u/eaglejarl [+2] (a day later)
Nothing to be sorry about! I'm just grateful that the answer is "I'd like to." :)
u/TimeLoopedPowerGamer [+1] Utopian Smut Peddler (3 days later)
So much of your time in TYE is spent explaining why the world doesn't work without lots of glue and binding wire. I'd really like to see what you can do world-building-wise outside of those requirements. The few hints we've gotten have been very good, but still have to exist in this broken rule set world.
I think what I'm trying to say is, you seem to have good writing chops. It would be a shame to get stuck on TYE as either a genre or a setting. I'd be more interested in funding an original project than more TYE-world stuff.
Something D&D-like (or "lite") would be cool, like what nobody103 is doing with Mother of Learning. You seem to be suggesting this is your goal, but you're also saying sequels to TYE...so I'm a little confused at that. If this sort of thing is what you're planning anyway, then great. If not, then I urge you to reconsider. Building new worlds is hard, but you can always crib from old works shamelessly. It's what all the pros do, after all.
As for funding, Patreon for extra side projects or accelerated publishing seems like a popular and effective strategy, and would be the sort of thing I'd support. Then, after the project is started and gaining momentum, run a Kickstarter for self-publishing physical books for the first 100k word long part (a reward level) and for future web hosting costs for the finished digital work.
Good luck, and good writing.
u/eaglejarl [+2] (3 days later)
You've pretty much got it as to my plan. the next story/ ies would be in an original world but the Drauga War would be part of the background... I think. Not the actual events -- Jake wouldn't be in the picture but the war would, the gods would, Albrecht would, etc.
I would rationalize the magic system ...right now I'm thinking something where magic happens by negotiating with special spirits -- gods, extraplanar creatures, spirits of trees /rivers etc -- for favors. I guess it would be less a direct sequel and more a spiritual one.
EDIT: Spelling. Stupid iPhone auto-correct and tiny little screen that makes proofreading hard.