39 KiB
[FF][RST] Team Anko - Chapter 17
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Author: u/eaglejarl *
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Score: 20
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Created: 2015-08-16T14:25:52
Post:
Comments:
u/rp20 [+7] (13 hours later)
How is this even a reasonable ignorance of technology. If assault rifles exist and airplanes exist then the technology gap is absurd to have not been noticed. Also to think that a capitalist republic that got to where it's at by exploiting material resources not trading or invading new lands is absurd(google countries not invaded by Britain). Both sides are developed militarily. They show no signs of pacifism that would lead them away from conquest. The elemental nations should have been conquered a 100 years ago.
u/eaglejarl [+4] (21 hours later)
The elemental nations should have been conquered a 100 years ago.
My take is that the 'Citizen's Free Republic' (its full name) is something like Meji Japan -- highly xenophobic and isolationist. They've been involved in a war with a nearby country for a long time, mostly because of the other country's aggression. Between those two things neither country spent much time exploring.
u/Running_Ostrich [+5] (a day later)
I'm having trouble suspending my disbelief that in your world you have supersonic strategic bombers, but no enterprising explorer has thought to exploit the natives of the elemental nations for their natural resources. Maybe it could be explained away by saying chakra somehow affects their actions to make them more isolationist?
Though, there's not a lot you can do when thrown into a world where the setting doesn't make sense in the first place.
u/eaglejarl [+3] (a day later)
I'm having trouble suspending my disbelief that in your world you have supersonic strategic bombers, but no enterprising explorer has thought to exploit the natives of the elemental nations for their natural resources.
My assumption at this point is that the Republic literally doesn't know about the EN, that their discovery is very recent -- just in the last few years.
Though, there's not a lot you can do when thrown into a world where the setting doesn't make sense in the first place.
True, that. And, of course, there's the whole thing about "if the Republic has satellites, why haven't the EN turned up on them?"
The best thing I've come up with so far is "because the Sage set up a muggle-repelling field over the EN". It's feasible, since this is the guy who literally created the moon so he certainly had the power levels. I'm not thrilled with it, but this setting is so completely whack that I'm having to buy a lot of plot-hole-filler. The cloak, of course, would be breaking down because it's been a thousand years and it's running out of energy.
I'm still looking for a better answer, but that's the best I've got so far -- the Republic is highly isolationist so they didn't do much boots-on-the-ground or long-range-aerial exploration, there's a lot of naval navigational hazards between here and there to keep ships away, and the magic chakra cloak kept eyes in the sky from spotting the EN.
It would have been simpler had I put the Republic's tech level earlier as I had originally intended, but then I wouldn't be doing the setting that Kishimoto created, which is what I'm trying to rationalize. As you can see, it's non-trivial.
u/Kishoto [+1] (a day later)
Also, as per a comment I made above, don't you think colonization would be significantly impacted by the fact that they'd be dealing with fire breathing super men, instead of spear chucking natives? Especially considering the pre-village era, which was fairly chaotic, disorganized and war filled.
u/eaglejarl [+3] (a day later)
Probably.
Hm. That could be part of it -- they came here a hundred years ago, got their butts kicked, and then the place became a "here be dragons" mark on the map. Now that the modern era is here and they've stopped being distracted by the war and they've stopped being quite so isolationist, they're reaching out again.
u/Kishoto [+1] (a day later)
Yea, I mean, even as a regular, non-isolationist nation, I'd be wary of trying to colonize a place where the people are faster than sound and throwing around the elements. Shit, depending on the level of religious permeation of the Republic, they could've been stuck in thinking of the EN as a place of demonic men. It's what I'd think if I sent out explorers who either never make it back or come back bearing tales of lightning firing men, or men with blood red eyes that could kill you with a glance.
That goes double if they ever land and encounter a bijuu. Any theocracy worth its salt could use the bijuu's existence to promote their agenda. Just look at us now. There are several places that still buy into voodoo, witchcraft, demon possession, etc. with ZERO evidence. Imagine if you actually had some photos of a giant fox that let off this concentrated aura of malice.
Edit: Zero TANGIBLE evidence. As we know, there are more than enough "real" accounts of these things by people.
u/rp20 [+1] (a day later)
Then that neighboring country should be conquering the elemental nations. Bet they won't have qualms about having colonies.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Actually, the Republic won.
But, yes. You take my point.
u/rp20 [+1] (a day later)
Did they win a 100 years ago? Aggressive nations don deny themselves opportunities to expand their raw resource sources.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
From the chapter:
Nine years ago, the Republic finished a decades-long war of conquest across their continent.
They've spent the intervening time (and will spend a bit more) solidifying their grip on their new territory and getting things integrated.
u/rp20 [+1] (a day later)
Right then they don't have an excuse for not doing anything to the elemental nations in the past 100 years. The war was a decades long only right?
u/Kishoto [+1] (a day later)
Decades as in multiple decades. Not one. (Sidenote: Your grammar isn't great, is english your second language? That's not an attempt to be snide, it's an honest inquiry)
And you can't ignore that they simply may not have been aware of the Elemental Nations for a time, especially if they've been occupied by what's on their own landmass. It's not impossible to believe they simply aren't that developed when it comes to exploration.
I agree with you, in that it's a bit hard to believe, but it's definitely not impossible. I wonder how the American colonies would've fared if they had to deal with super ninjas capable of throwing out fire dragons, instead of spear chucking natives.
u/rp20 [+1] (a day later)
Since the m16 exists in the story, you pretty much have to admit that we are looking at Vietnam war era military technology. Now I don't know about you but I'm gonna low ball the length of the war. Wars four times the length of WWII or more is a little unbelievable. You could probably flatten every city and town on earth in less than ten years(lets assume no nuclear weapons).
WWI era tech can decimate the shinobi population. No way are the shinobi even a threat. The American civil war had the gatling gun so they could go toe to toe against the shinobi too. There is no excuse for the elemental nations to be this isolated from advancements in military technology.
u/JackStargazer [+2] Primordial Apologist (2 days later)
WWI era tech can decimate the shinobi population.
Well, it can decimate the civilian population, but do remember that the shinobi have invisibility, supersonic movement on the tactical level, giant fuckoff summoned monsters, unkillable zombies, near infinite effectively free suicide bombers (clones), and massive area of effect damage potential.
While WWI era tech could go through most Genin and lower easily enough, it lacks the strategic reach (other than some Artillery) to effectively deal with even a small team of high-tier ninja. The only halfway decent transportation method available is railroad, which can be outpaced and easily sabotaged by even powerful Genin level ninja, and whose tracks are logistically impossible to be guarded along their entire length.
That's not even including what is now my favorite new way to win a Darwin Award, also known as 'trench warfare against earthbenders'.
Flight is low altitude wood and paper based, and your opponents can breathe seeking fire dragons.
Your best bet is incendiary rounds, except some of your opponents can also breathe lakes of water, so that's out.
It isn't until massive high altitude strategic bombing, long range flight logistics, and effective long range ground transport shows up in WWII that the superiority truly shifts to the Tech side.
u/rp20 [+1] (2 days later)
Doesn't matter when you can throw millions of bodies and weapons at the shinobi. The shinobi are not that large in population. Also whatever you may think, the overpowered shinobi are probably in the handful range.
On top of that, you can bet that elemental nations would not very readily unite. They had to be convinced of a world ending threat to even work against akatsuki. You can bet that the republic can easily pick at the nations one by one and if necessary, ally themselves with one village or the other to share some spoils of war. That is how the native Americans were conquered anyway.
u/JackStargazer [+1] Primordial Apologist (2 days later)
Doesn't matter when you can throw millions of bodies and weapons at the shinobi.
That's what I'm getting at: You cannot do that at WWI tech levels. WWI required a heavy, heavy network of preexisting rail lines built up over years to enable effective logisitics. One of the main reasons for the beginning of the war happening the way it did was because of the need to strike out at Russia before it could mobilize. Those rail lines took decades to build, in areas completely under their own control, and there were large standing armies waiting at the borders. None of that is possible here on a separate landmass. And at WWI tech levels, one water-specialist Jonin can seriously hinder or destroy entire fleets of transport ships (not getting into the crazy logistics on bringing a million strong army over an entire ocean - D Day was over a tiny channel and 1/4th of the men, thirty years later!) - at least submarine level fire, at a time when the early German U-boats had to surface to fire.
You're seriously overestimating turn of the 20th century technology. These are not easy problems to solve.
u/rp20 [+1] (2 days later)
You don't have to throw millions of soldiers all at once. The republic can simply outlast the Shinobi. Chakra users take years to train and that investment can be thrown away in a short amount of time. The republic can train soldiers in a shorter amount of time and still be effective.
Also the ships in WWI are well armored(Ironclads existed during the civil war). You can bet that water techniques are gonna have a hard time destroying them. The ships are also better equipped to attack from a distance. One jonin can't really take on dozens and dozens of ships like these.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (6 days later)
You cannot do that at WWI tech levels.
For the record, the Republic's tech is actually that of 1974 USA -- Vietnam war era. Both you and rp20 had good points, but I figured I'd just set the record straight on that one item.
u/JackStargazer [+1] Primordial Apologist (6 days later)
Oh yes, I know, but the OP of this threadline mentioned WWI as a 'Even this far autowins' example.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (6 days later)
Ah, right. Yeah, that's not getting it done against ninja; trench warfare was effective only because it took long enough for the bad guys to charge across no-man's land that the good guys could get a few rifle volleys and a gatling-gun stonk off. Ninja wouldn't even be seen coming, and once they're in the trench with you, you're dead.
u/JackStargazer [+1] Primordial Apologist (6 days later)
Or they flood the trenches from 3 miles away. Or they go underground and collapse the trenches on you with Earth Jutsu. Or they send in Bunshin until your machine gun jams.
Or they act like actual ninjas and just poison your water supply.
And it goes on like this.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (6 days later)
Or they act like actual ninjas and just poison your water supply.
snicker
Indeed.
u/LeonCross [+4] (6 hours later)
I guess you're keeping things around the Wave Arc power levels for this? Speeds ranged from 80
m/s for the Genin up to about 120m/s for someone like Zabuza swinging his sword.By contrast, Gaara's sand shuriken are mach 14~ and things only scale massively up from there are the series progresses (4-5 digit mach at the end)
It's worth noting that Zabuza (and thus scalable to Jounin if sticking to wave arc power levels) displayed durability enough to be completely bullet proof. Ballparking somewhere between a building to a city block level explosive to outright kill them without looking up specific feats. Again, this goes through massive powerscaling as the series progresses (multi-city block for Gambunta and high+ tiers in the chuunin exams, up to moon level for God Tiers like Naruto and Kaguya at the end).
u/eaglejarl [+3] (7 hours later)
Speeds ranged from 80
m/s for the Genin up to about 120m/s for someone like Zabuza swinging his sword.Where did those numbers come from? Are they movement speeds or attack speeds? 80 m/s is 163 mph, which is kinda crazy.
I wasn't aware of that info, so I spitballed some movement speeds -- I'd have to check my notes for exactly what they were, but you can figure it out from the speed at which they covered ground when they first left Konoha.
4-5 digit mach at the end
Wow. That's orders of magnitude more than orbital velocity.
EDIT:
It's worth noting that Zabuza (and thus scalable to Jounin if sticking to wave arc power levels) displayed durability enough to be completely bullet proof.
When I was watching the anime I only managed to sit through part of the Wave Arc...I think I bailed out somewhere during the bridge fight, although I don't remember exactly. I'd be curious to know what happened that showed such durability, but I'm still going with the ruling that most ninja are glass cannons.
u/Kishoto [+3] (7 hours later)
4-5 digit mach at the end
Seriously? I mean, we know shinobi are fast, but those are speeds approaching 0.01c easy. There's the teleportation time/space jutsu used, which we can assume bypasses the normal laws of physics. But if ninja are really moving that fast, shouldn't they be being continuously set on fire by the friction they generate? And inflicting massive damage where they move, not just where they take off from?
Also, where are these numbers coming?
u/eaglejarl [+3] (7 hours later)
Also, where are these numbers coming?
My guess would be it's one of the databooks.
u/LeonCross [+3] (8 hours later)
Calcs. I'd have to dig through them, but Zabuzas durability probably comes from not dying from the water dragon.
While one can debate specific numbers and such, the displayed feats consistently scale up and up and up as the series progresses, so at best you can say they're between point a and b where that point is rediculous ly high by the end. The Sage made the moon to hold the juubi body for example. In the last movie, naruto basically blows the moon up. Etc.
Reading character debates and calculations for such things is one of my hobbies.
In the end, they're really not glass canons. Wave arc shows Jounin with sufficent durability to ignore conventional firearms. Gambunta and a weakened shuukaku in the exams demand a decent level of ordinance. At some point anything that can be scaled to some level of naruto tailed beast mode can shrug off nukes casually.
It's a shounin. That's how these things tend to work. Bleach was stuck at mach 20something for a few years which made it hilariously slow compared to the others.
That said, do what works best for your fic. Even if Zabuzas levels of Shinobi and up can tank or even dodge bullets demanding military levels of pay grade to deal with them, how many Zabuza level Shinobi are there at the end of the day? Not many I'd imagine.
So the Republic is still terrifying because they could murder all but something like 1% of the elemental countries. At which point it becomes mutually assured destruction. They could nuke the ninja to basically non-existence, but the few that are capable of surviving are beyond their ability to put down.
u/eaglejarl [+3] (28 seconds later)
Orochimaru almost literally drops a bomb.
Typoes and corrections in this thread, please.
u/Kishoto [+3] (32 minutes later)
u/eaglejarl [+8] (39 minutes later)
It's a major plot point.
This was actually supposed to be primarily a romance story about a developing relationship and the coming of age of the people involved. Then Orochimaru came on stage, laughed in my face, and told me what was really going to happen. Still, the romance will still be there, it will just be set against a rather different backdrop.
u/t3tsubo [+7] (an hour later)
Voldem... I mean Orochimaru for best character in the story easily.
u/eaglejarl [+2] (an hour later)
He's a lot of fun to write, yeah.
u/JackStargazer [+2] Primordial Apologist (8 hours later)
For some reason I read that as Voldemochimaru.
I think I have a new headcanon nickname.
u/MadScientist14159 [+2] WIP: Sodium Hypochlorite (Rational Bleach) Eventually. Maybe. (an hour later)
Kaguya vs
NATOThe Republic Military Corps?
u/eaglejarl [+1] (an hour later)
Do you mean the Kaguya clan? I wasn't familiar with them, but the wiki says that they're all dead.
Side topic: I hadn't realized just how much of Worm was lifted from the Naruto-verse. Many of Skitter's tricks (calling bugs, controlling bugs, bug clones, probably more) come from Shino, and her personality is even a bit like I understand his to be. Apparently the bone-manipulation powers of Panacea's dad were taken from the Kaguya. Orochimaru keeps souls of his prior victims in his head, similar to Glaistig Uaine's ability.
u/MadScientist14159 [+2] WIP: Sodium Hypochlorite (Rational Bleach) Eventually. Maybe. (2 hours later)
No, I meant Otsutsuki Kaguya, the final boss of the Narutoverse.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (2 hours later)
Ah, gotcha. I saw avret's post on this first and replied above.
u/avret [+2] SDHS rationalist (2 hours later)
If I'm understanding /u/MadScientist14159 correctly, he was referring to Kaguya, .
u/autowikiabot [+2] (2 hours later)
#####
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#### Kaguya Ōtsutsuki (from Naruto wikia):
Kaguya and her newborn sons. A millennium ago, Kaguya, longing for peace, believed that it was necessary for her to attain god-like powers in order to put an end to all of humanity's conflicts. For that reason, she defied the taboo of consuming the fruit of the Shinju. Using her new-found power, Kaguya single-handedly ended the wars, and for her deed, she was worshiped as the Rabbit Goddess (卯の女神, Usagi no Megami), and had settled down amongst humans, as she would eventually get pregnant and bear twin sons, Hagoromo and Hamura. As time passed, however, Kaguya began to lose trust in humanity as the power she now held ultimately corrupted her. This led her to madness as she created her ideal of peace by trapping her victims in the Infinite Tsukuyomi and converting them into White Zetsu, which changed her public image from that of a benevolent goddess into that of a Demon (鬼, Oni). In a fit of envy that her own sons had inherited her chakra, Kaguya combined with the Shinju itself and turned against them in the form of the monstrous Ten-Tails. Their intense battle ended with Hagoromo and Hamura separating and absorbing their mother's powerful chakra while sealing her body to form the core of a celestial body that would become known as the moon. Hamura later departed along with the rest of the Ōtsutsuki clan to the moon to guard his mother's remains, while Hagoromo stayed in order to spread chakra to humanity and teach them the concept of Ninshū.
However, just before her sons could completely seal her, Kaguya manifested her will into the form of an artificial being called Black Zetsu. With the agenda of reviving its creator or "mother", Black Zetsu manipulated the Sage's son, Indra Ōtsutsuki, and his descendants: the Uchiha clan, along with Asura Ōtsutsuki's descendants: the Senju clan, all in an attempt to get one of them to awaken the Rinnegan. Madara Uchiha would eventually succeed in doing so, and Black Zetsu began secretly manipulating world events to have Kaguya revived. Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) Image ^(i) ^Interesting: [^Kaguya ^Ōtsutsuki ^Strikes](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya Ōtsutsuki Strikes) ^| [^Hamura ^Ōtsutsuki](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hamura Ōtsutsuki) ^| [^Ōtsutsuki ^Clan](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Ōtsutsuki Clan) ^| [^Hagoromo ^Ōtsutsuki](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Hagoromo Ōtsutsuki)^Parent ^commenter ^can [^toggle ^NSFW](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikiabot&subject=AutoWikibot NSFW toggle&message=%2Btoggle-nsfw+cu4y7by) ^or [^delete](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikiabot&subject=AutoWikibot Deletion&message=%2Bdelete+cu4y7by)^. ^Will ^also ^delete ^on ^comment ^score ^of ^-1 ^or ^less. ^| ^(FAQs) ^| ^Source ^(Please note this bot is in testing. Any help would be greatly appreciated, even if it is just a bug report! Please checkout the) ^source ^code ^(to submit bugs)
u/eaglejarl [+1] (2 hours later)
Oh, right. I hadn't realized she actually came back; I thought she stayed locked away.
Well, the story is currently somewhere near the beginning / early-middle of the Wave arc, so she's quite a ways away. And probably not in any case -- she's effectively a god, and battles involving gods are boring.
u/None [+3] (3 hours later)
Battles involving gods are only boring when there are only gods on one side.
u/eaglejarl [+3] (4 hours later)
Let's define terms: by 'god', I'm talking about an essentially immortal with few if any limits. By 'battle' I mean a confrontation centered around physical violence.
Onscreen god battles can be great scenery, but they make for boring plot elements; humans and heroes can't meaningfully participate in god battles, so your protagonists are left standing to one side watching. You can try to put heroes up against gods in a dramatic struggle, but then there's only two stories you can tell:
- God wins instantly.
- God is an idiot (or picks up the idiot ball) and loses. Probably after a long, drawn-out battle that causes DarknessInducedAudienceApathy.
Superman and Batman are arguably the two most iconic superheroes of all time. Batman is a dark and brooding human being who suffers actual pain that readers can relate to. ("Oh my god, he fell off the building, that must have hurt!") You can understand Batman's limits and intuit whether he's doing well or badly in a fight, how much damage he's taken, and what effect that's going to have on him. More importantly, he is someone that, at least in theory, the reader could be -- if you train hard enough and were determined enough, you could be an awesome martial artist, expert linguist, etc. (I'm obviously exaggerating a little because Batman is a billionaire, has all the skills, and can sustain comic-book no-permanent-damage injuries, but you take my point.) He's had ridiculous numbers of cartoons, movies, comics, graphic novels, etc done about him because he's interesting.
Superman, on the other hand, is more or less a god. Nothing that really exists can challenge him in a fight, so in order to provide opponents for him you have to bring in other gods. You can't tell how he's doing in a fight because his ability to absorb damage is "as much as the plot requires." There's never much tension because it's not something the audience can really relate to from personal experience.
/u/alexanderwales managed to write an interesting Superman story by never having a battle and primarily focusing on Luthor instead of Superman. Superman's onscreen time was mostly to showcase his unadmirable qualities and show his moral decay. Again, no battles, and the story was really about a different character.
u/None [+1] (6 hours later)
Have you read City of Stairs? It manages to make battles with gods both plausible and interesting, even with only one side having the gods. Not rational, precisely, but the we-don't-see-all-the-rules-of-the-world-clearly kind of not rational rather than the people-act-stupidly kind of not-rational.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (6 hours later)
I haven't, no. What's the story?
u/None [+1] (8 hours later)
Mmm, it's a mystery set in a fantasy world.
u/avret [+1] SDHS rationalist (2 hours later)
Ok, makes sense.
u/dwibby [+1] (23 hours later)
Be careful with Kaguya and Black Zetsu in general; Kishimoto ended up making them the root cause for basically everything. If they are near their canon characterizations, Black Zetsu has been running around for nearly a millennium being "Kaguya's Will," spying on high-tier ninja and orchestrating complex manipulations of those ninja. Even keeping Naruto low-tier isn't defense against Black Zetsu, as one of his powers makes Naruto and Sasuke prime candidates for him to pay attention to.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
Will do.
Honestly, I think I may just ignore the rest of canon. I like the world and most of the characters, but I think there are more interesting directions to take it than retreading the stations of the canon.
u/pedanterrific [+2] (15 hours later)
Mouse Protector's power was basically Minato-lite, teleporting to set tags and increased agility. Satyrical can make shadow clones which can perform henge.
u/Kishoto [+2] (a day later)
I think that's more coincidence than anything else. Wildbow had literally hundreds of different capes with different powers. Something as common place as short range teleportation kind of HAD to show up.
And cloning isn't all that unique either. I would hesitate to say he copied the shadow clone ability at all. I'm not saying it's impossible, but the power is a very generic one, and it's more than plausible he used it as it's a common power, as opposed to drawing it from a specific source.
u/pedanterrific [+1] (a day later)
I was just drawing parallels, not claiming direct inspiration. And both of those examples are on firmer ground than claiming Taylor's personality is like Shino's or that there's a link between Orochimaru and Glaistig Uaine.
Certainly there's a lot less evidence than the theory (I don't know if there's been author confirmation) that the Triumvirate (and Hero) have Golden Age Superman's powers divided between them.
u/autowikiabot [+1] (an hour later)
#####
######
#### Kaguya Clan (from Naruto wikia):
The Kaguya clan's destruction. The Kaguya clan were descendants of Kaguya Ōtsutsuki, and selective few, namely Kimimaro, possessed the kekkei genkai Shikotsumyaku from Kaguya's original bone-manipulating ability. This ability was so powerful that even the war-loving Kaguya clan feared it. The clan was noted for being very savage and battle-hungry, having no tactics when entering battle that they initiated simply to show off their ferocity. It was due to this failed attempt to prove themselves that the entire clan was killed off when attacking Kirigakure; even when surrounded and completely outmatched, they refused to back down, preferring to fight to the death simply to entertain their own bloodlust to the last. Image ^(i) Image ^(i) ^Interesting: [^Kaguya ^(disambiguation)](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya (disambiguation)) ^| [^Kaguya ^Ōtsutsuki](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya Ōtsutsuki) ^| ^Clans ^| [^Kaguya ^Ōtsutsuki ^Strikes](https://naruto.wikia.com/wiki/Kaguya Ōtsutsuki Strikes)
^Parent ^commenter ^can [^toggle ^NSFW](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikiabot&subject=AutoWikibot NSFW toggle&message=%2Btoggle-nsfw+cu4y0ua) ^or [^delete](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=autowikiabot&subject=AutoWikibot Deletion&message=%2Bdelete+cu4y0ua)^. ^Will ^also ^delete ^on ^comment ^score ^of ^-1 ^or ^less. ^| ^(FAQs) ^| ^Source ^(Please note this bot is in testing. Any help would be greatly appreciated, even if it is just a bug report! Please checkout the) ^source ^code ^(to submit bugs)
u/ZeroNihilist [+2] (2 hours later)
u/eaglejarl [+3] (2 hours later)
possible that the Republic can use chakra-imbued stuff
Yep. The Elemental Nations are already trading seals to them in exchange for mechanismic gear.
Yes, although not easily. I had to do some world-building as to what stuff he could clone and, among other restrictions, he's got to be physically carrying it when he clones himself. (i.e., it can't be beside him or in a sealing scroll) That puts a weight limit on what he can produce.
There is the but I haven't decided if I'm going to let it exist in my world. It's such a ridiculous game-changer if it does.
EDIT: I should add that, so far, the Republic is pretty much ignorant of the existence of the Elemental Nations. They're still very isolationist and only slowly opening up. A very few adventurous entrepreneurs have gone exploring and are conducting trade with the EN, but it's all being smuggled and treated as a very closely-guarded trade secret, as they don't want to lose their monopoly.
u/avret [+1] SDHS rationalist (4 hours later)
Does this universe contain gravity/reverse gravity seals?
u/eaglejarl [+1] (4 hours later)
I'm using the wiki as my source of canon so if it's on there then it's included. As far as people and events I'm trying to keep the timelines matched up with canon, but that's hard to do so I'm not worrying about it too much.
u/avret [+1] SDHS rationalist (8 hours later)
Ok.
u/liamash3 [+2] Mizu (9 hours later)
I always like seeing what your Orochimaru gets up to. He has a refreshingly interesting way of thinking.
u/None [+1] (13 hours later)
I find it kind of funny that the first black guy in the story is named Corporal Blake.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (21 hours later)
Why is that funny? He's an expy of Jonas Blaine from The Unit -- if there's some other reference, then I'm not familiar with it.
EDIT: Oh, wait. "Blake" sounds like "Black." That didn't occur to me.
u/eaglejarl [+1] (a day later)
/u/MadScientist14159:
I forgot to ask this a chapter or two ago when it was addressed: you were bothered by the moral implications of the kage bunshin. What was your reaction to the explanation that Naruto gave back in chapter 15?
u/MadScientist14159 [+3] WIP: Sodium Hypochlorite (Rational Bleach) Eventually. Maybe. (a day later)
I understand his reasoning and respect his decision.
That said, OHGODWHATTHEFUCKISWRONGWITHHIM?!?!? Knowingly condemning himself to death for trivial things like setting up camp a little faster? What sane person would consider that a valid trade off? Sure, the clones get an opportunity to exist, but they were already existing as Prime. Making the clones doesn't actually give them any net existential gain. It only makes a version of Naruto that will quickly die.
I mean... he... all of him... seem happy with it, and that's the main thing, I guess, but it's still horrible. He commits mass suicide nearly every day. I can't be okay with that, even if he is.
u/Kishoto [+1] (2 days later)
Well, I guess you and Naruto have massively different values and world outlooks then.