17 KiB
[RT][FF] Naruto. The Need to Become Stronger, Chapter 35: Friendship and Fallout
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Author: u/Sophronius The Need to Become Stronger*
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URL: https://needtobecomestronger.wordpress.com/2018/02/21/chapter-35/
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Score: 32
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Created: 2018-02-21T19:47:57
Post:
Comments:
u/Sophronius [+23] The Need to Become Stronger (28 minutes later)
A/N: That's it for now! I've reached the end of my pre-written material, and although I have planned out the rest of the story long in advance I now need to spend some time to write up the next act. Well, technically we reached the end of act 3 a while ago - probably when Naruto was being trained by Jiraiya - so maybe this is act 3b? I dunno, the act structure has gotten a little wonky.
The point is, there won't be any chapters for a while. In the meantime, please check out Scar's Samsara if you haven't already: It's a finished rational story set in the Lion King universe which features magical kung-fu animals, so it's basically the same as Naruto. :p I have the sequel to this story just about finished, and I'm planning to start posting that while I write up the next act so you guys have something to read while you wait. Needless to say it's incredibly hard to write two stories at the same time, but hopefully I can juggle it and it won't cause any further delays.
I hope to see you guys again soon!
u/xartab [+11] (3 hours later)
I'm crying here. Just to let you know.
u/CaseyAshford [+13] (an hour later)
Fantastic update as usual.
After reading this a theory that came to mind is the possibility that the death of Gaara is something that was intended by the Kazekage. My thinking is that Gaara had become a significant liability as his violently unstable nature and willingness to disobey orders had overcome the benefits of his power. The Kazekage needed to get rid of him but doing so presented a problem as killing his son would significantly damage his reputation and further alienate him from his heirs. The solution to this problem was to place Gaara in the Chuunin exams and simply let the enemies that Gaara makes among the Leef Genin dispose of him.
The advantage of this plan is that either way the Kazekage stands to benefit. If Gaara manages to survive than he will have undoubtedly have killed enough Leaf Genin and openly violated enough rules to provide the Kazekage with the perfect justification for having him killed. If Gaara is killed than he now can avoid any harm to his reputation and gain profit in the form of restitution from a Konoha that wants to prevent the rash actions of a single Genin from igniting a war.
Anyone have a response to this Theory? I really like the idea that while Naruto perceives his actions as an epic struggle against a force of evil and a rejection of the realpolitik that feeds of the blood of children he is simply acting as a pawn in a political strategy.
u/kaukamieli [+7] (5 hours later)
I don't buy anyone thought Gaara could be killed in the tests. He was supposed to be the perfect killing machine. In a war? Sure, against people who know what they fight against and can plan against that. In 1v1 fights against green fence painter genins? Lol.
u/CaseyAshford [+8] (5 hours later)
That is why I argued that the Kazekage was pursuing a win-win strategy where the survival of Gaara would still provide him with some benefits even though his death at the hands of another competitor would be preferable.
I would also argue that the idea of a Leaf Genin managing to kill Gaara is not totally unexpected as the current generation is comprised of clan heirs. The idea that one of them would possess enough skill or acquire a sufficiently powerful technique from a family member does not seem that unlikely.
The probability of Gaara dying at the hands of Leaf Genin would only seem to increase as the Chuunin Exams progressed and the full capabilities of Naruto and Sasuke were revealed.
u/kaukamieli [+2] (6 hours later)
Afaik Gaara is a battle-hardened ninja who has fought anbu-level people before. His village wanted him dead and tried to assassinate him multiple times. They then decided they'd just use him as weapon instead. I can't buy this theory. Gaara can't even understand getting wounded and he can do the tailed beast transformation safely if all else fails and no clan kid should be able to beat that.
I can understand ino-shika-cho, but do every clan time their kids to the same year? :s
u/CaseyAshford [+5] (8 hours later)
I am not going to restate my argument on the nature of the Kazekage's plot so I would recommend that you re-read my earlier posts but here are two key points that you may have missed.
As part of the general setting rewrite the idea that the Kazekage had been trying and failing to kill his son via the direct attack of elite ninja has been removed. The opposite of the case appears to be present as Gaara explained that he was highly valued by his father even to the point where a boy was killed for spitting on him.
Gaara and all the inhabitants of the world are mortal. Any ninja can be killed by a sufficiently skilled foe. All it would take for Gaara to be killed is for a foe with a means of breaching his sand armor to strike a single direct blow. This is a capability that an informed outside observer like the Kazekage could perceive to be conceivably within the reach of the Leaf Genin competing in the exam. (EX: Chidori, Rasengan)
u/kaukamieli [+3] (11 hours later)
If his history is stated to be completely different, I have no recalling of this. I read too many naruto fanfics simultaneously and they do tend to meld together a bit. What happened to his mother then and how dis he become like this?
The spitting thing could just in itself be easily explained by not allowing citizens to show disdain for the ruling class and can be completely differeny thing from what they themselves do in the shadows.
u/RynnisOne [+1] (19 hours later)
Not all ANBU are created equal.
It's fairly safe to say that, in this universe, the Leaf ANBU are going to be more skilled and experienced than those of other nations, because the Leaf started the concept of the ANBU to begin with. They've had years, if not decades, of experience and institutional knowledge to accrue.
u/RynnisOne [+4] (19 hours later)
I see it as the reverse...
If anyone is capable of stopping him and getting away with it, it's Naruto.
Consider... Gaara is the son of the Kage of his village, and is the bearer of a Tailed Beast. Most normal people he can kill and get away with it, like most nobles could with commoners throughout history. Anything else might provoke a war, and what feudal ruler is going to go to war over the life of a peasant?
So what if there was another way, a way to get rid of him while making it 'reasonable', by pitting him against someone of equivalent standing?
Because Naruto is also the son of a Kage (mind you, the Fourth is dead, but still). He too is the bearer of a Tailed Beast. The fact that they both went into the fight willingly and Gaara escalated it to where he threatened to kill Naruto and his friends means the responsibility of Gaara's death is on Gaara himself. The Sand can't argue that the Leaf is crazy for wanting to defend some random person, because they are literally standing up for their equivalent of Gaara.
u/Sophronius [+2] The Need to Become Stronger (a day later)
This theory is somewhat hampered by the fact that neither the Sand or the Leaf is willing to reveal who their jinchuriki are. Even though the Hokage at least totally knows this already about Gaara. Because ninjas have a pathological need for secrecy, that's why.
Mind you, you are right that Naruto is one of the only people who could walk out of that room with the Hokage after killing Gaara without any consequences (so far), but that's only a benefit from Naruto's perspective.
u/noahpocalypse [+9] (5 hours later)
I need more rational Naruto in my life. Ideally, I'd like a complete rational Naruto fic- Lighting Up the Dark was good but I think it's dead. So please don't give up or go dark for too long! Your story is wonderful. As others said, I like how Naruto isn't a bastion of reason come to civilize the savages, and I'm pretty sure that at least one someone is playing him.
u/orangedragan [+2] (a day later)
I checked with the author of LUTD, and he mentioned hes currently revising and rewriting. So keep an eye on his author page.
u/Sophronius [+1] The Need to Become Stronger (a day later)
I'm going to choose to believe that you are Noah Smith from Noahpinion purely on the basis of your name, even though this is super unlikely.
Also, Naruto is a flawless rationalist ubermensch, I don't know what you're talking about. :s
u/noahpocalypse [+1] (a day later)
I’m afraid I’ve never heard of Noah Smith, sorry to be a disappointment! I’m not particularly Internet-special. I’m just another dude named Noah who wanted to make his username a bad pun.
u/4t0m [+6] Chaos Legion (a day later)
Alright, your Sasuke has finally won me over. By the way, did he Sharingan-brainwash Neji in the darkness? Kind of suspicious that Neji found common ground with Sasuke after their fight and that he seemed to be more friendly towards Hinata. Maybe this was supposed to be obvious since his eyes were no longer covered when the match ended?
Anyway, on re-reading the Gaara fight I no longer had much of a problem with it. I do think that the Gaara/Naruto dynamic could have been stronger or better motivated, but I'm not really sure what the problem was. I never totally bought into Naruto's argument that it was his responsibility to deal with Gaara -- it seemed much more like Gaara was an outlet for his frustration and need for agency. Maybe Gaara's philosophy could have been more symbolic of the general cruelty of the exam... but I guess you did gesture at that. Much more might have been annoying.
I recently reread the Waves Arc, and noticed that while other characters may not be as clever as Naruto, they have very good introspection and are prodigies at amateur philosophy. They notice the patterns they are acting out and the forces that determine their actions, and so the conflicts feel more meaningful because the antagonists occupy stable philosophical attractors that won't readily converge with Naruto, but aren't obviously dumb. We got a lot of this with Haku and Itachi, and some from Gaara although this was hampered by his instability.
It's actually interesting that Naruto (along with Sasuke and Sakura) is much less reflective than many of the other characters (eg Shikamaru or even Shino, in addition to those I mentioned above). I'm hoping we'll see Team 7 grow in thoughtfulness, and eventually surpass the others by breaking out of their frame / their roles / the Nash equilibria they are in. In any event, the depth to the world and the rest of the cast really makes this story stand out among rational fic. I'm looking forward to your return!
On that note, do you have a rough estimate of how long this fic will be?
P.S. Finally read (and quite enjoyed) Scar's Samsara. Thanks for the reminder!
u/Sophronius [+6] The Need to Become Stronger (a day later)
Thanks very much for all the praise! It seems a lot of people are starting to like this fic more and more, which is a good sign as my writing should be getting better.
By the way, did he Sharingan-brainwash Neji in the darkness?
Hm, an interesting theory. Certainly not one anyone else has brought up so far. :)
I never totally bought into Naruto's argument that it was his responsibility to deal with Gaara -- it seemed much more like Gaara was an outlet for his frustration and need for agency.
That's a perceptive point! You're right, Gaara is much more of a 'force of nature' than Haku. Haku represented the rationalist's frustration of having to fight an intelligent, reasonable person who nonetheless insists on being your enemy. Gaara represents more the sheer impossibility of trying to reach out to someone who is not interested in being reasonable at all. If that had not been the case, Naruto would not have needed to kill him. He was the death of Naruto's naive belief that reason is always the answer, basically.
Itachi, of course, is supposed to be genuinely unnerving by virtue of the contrast between how he talks and acts.
It's actually interesting that Naruto (along with Sasuke and Sakura) is much less reflective than many of the other characters
Eh, it's not so much that he is unreflective, as that he is a very emotional person who tends to get caught up in the moment. He doesn't always think before he acts, but in between the action he certainly does take the time to wonder about what he is doing why. And it is precisely because he has such a good understanding of his own thoughts that he finds himself despairing at his inability to change the way he acts.
Also, I wouldn't give Shikamaru too much credit: Sure, he's much more intellectual than Naruto, but there'll be a scene from Shikamaru's perspective later where he discovers exactly how crippling his own weaknesses are...
On that note, do you have a rough estimate of how long this fic will be?
About 1000 pages in total, probably. 5 acts, so right now we'd be... at 2/rds? Half? These things always tend to grow and grow until they reach George R. R. Martin levels, though...
P.S. Finally read (and quite enjoyed) Scar's Samsara. Thanks for the reminder!
Great to hear! I recently reread it as well, and I'm still really proud about the mood I managed to set. At least, I think I did a good job there.
u/Gigapode [+6] (7 hours later)
Damn it Sophronius! My juvenile mind needs a happy ending to feel truly satisfied. Still a great read though, even when it does paint a bleak picture.
I recoginse the signs of some unreliable narration and Naruto's (Kurama-induced?) rage leading him to take actions he then recognises as wrong but I think you could make it slightly more overt/obvious because I kept second-guessing it. Maybe thats just me prjecting and hes acting like a normal adolescent would.
As a specific point about Naruto's perspective: just before his fight with Gaara, was the bug-infusion scene supposed to indicate that it was changing how he thought and making him more aggressive? Or just a clarity of mind/purpose thing?
u/Sophronius [+2] The Need to Become Stronger (a day later)
I recoginse the signs of some unreliable narration and Naruto's >(Kurama-induced?) rage leading him to take actions he then recognises as wrong but I think you could make it slightly more overt/obvious because I kept second-guessing it.
An interesting thought! But I don't need to make my hidden sekkret plot points obvious, because all of my readers are geniuses who will pick up on them anyway. :)
Well, I mean, I sure hope so. Otherwise there is the risk of me ending this story with all of my readers going "wait what just happened" while one or two people go "well that was straightforward".
As a specific point about Naruto's perspective: just before his fight with Gaara, was the bug-infusion scene supposed to indicate that it was changing how he thought and making him more aggressive?
Nope. Naruto was going "say what's in this drink" to excuse the fact that the show of friendship from all of his former rivals was making him super emotional.
u/tokol [+3] The Greater Good (2 hours later)
Typo:
the expression on his face him look older than ever.
face him -> face made him
u/Sophronius [+5] The Need to Become Stronger (3 hours later)
Thanks! Come to think of it I should also change "expression" to "weariness" or something. Vagueness in descriptions makes it less evocative = bad.
u/Ilverin [+3] (4 hours later)
hatred that never seizes in its attempts
I think ceases instead of seizes for this typo
u/jaghataikhan [+3] Primarch of the White Scars (a day later)
Really like the phrasing "daemon host" - gives things a 40k flavor
u/None [+1] (2 months later)
Hey, I just finished reading your story on your webstite, from chapter 1 to 35 in a week-end. I really, really enjoyed it. Looking forward to the continuation whenever it's ready!