scrape_r_rational/data/cache2/2pfc78.md

## Demon, The Story of A Rational Sociopath

* Author: u/xamueljones  *My arch-enemy is entropy**
* URL: https://www.reddit.com/r/rational/comments/2pfc78/demon_the_story_of_a_rational_sociopath/
* Score: 20

* Created: 2014-12-16T02:23:45

### Post:

I've been reading through this webcomic, [Demon](http://www.shigabooks.com/?page=001), which is created by Jason Shiga, the same guy who drew [Fleep](http://www.aaronsw.com/2002/fleep/) (a rational webcomic) and [Meanwhile](http://www.amazon.com/Meanwhile-Path-Possibilities-Graphic-Novels/dp/0810984237) (a brilliant choose-your-path story).

Jimmy develops the power to possess other people every time he dies and he uses this power to rescue his daughter from a nearly all-powerful military organization.

I'm wondering for those of us who has read it, is it rational? It definitely has clever problem solving, logical investigation, and social manipulation. But it seems more munchkiny than rational/rationalist. What do you think?

P.S. For further discussion, do you think Jimmy is a sociopath for using his abilities to achieve his goals at **any** cost?

**Trigger warning** : There is suicide, murder, some nudity (males only) and in chapter 5 (starting around page 130), a very disgusting method of suicide involving body fluids. It's not as bad as it sounds, since the art style doesn't make it look too life-like or vivid, but it's fairly gross. Only for that chapter does it get that bad though, the visuals for the rest of the comic is not as gruesome (even if it involves a higher body count).

### Comments:

> **u/Calsem** [+8]  (3 hours later)
> 
> It's a good comic, but I find it hard to believe that Jimmy could consistently manage to escape the organization.  For example, in the latest chapter,  [](#s "why the heck does Denny get so close to Jimmy?  Why does Hunter not immediately shoot Denny with a tranq as soon as Denny turns?  Why does the SWAT team not have a safeword with Denny to make sure Denny is not possessed?" )

>> **u/khafra** [+19]  (10 hours later)
>> 
>> Yeah, their master/stranger protocols are clearly lacking.

>> **u/None** [+5]  (19 hours later)
>> 
>> I haven't actually read it yet, but 'tranqs' really don't work like that. I mean, that's why we have anesthesiologists and why they're highly paid -  because it's really hard to knock someone out without killing them. Just a small caveat though.

>>> **u/derefr** [+3]  (a day later)
>>> 
>>> There aren't *too* many variables involved, though. It'd be reasonably easy to engineer, say, a tranq gun that figured out the BMI of whatever it was looking at, and dialed its darts to an appropriate shot.

>>>> **u/None** [+2]  (a day later)
>>>> 
>>>> Hmm, that's an idea. I don't know about easy, but it could be possible I guess. I think you would have to know metabolism and heart rate too though -  maybe you could use infrared cameras to figure out heart rate...

>>>>> **u/Superguy2876** [+2]  (2 days later)
>>>>> 
>>>>> heart rate is quite easy to figure out through video, [here](http://people.csail.mit.edu/mrub/vidmag/) is an algorithm made by MIT that can do just that. Using only the visual spectrum of light some skin probably needs to be showing though, maybe it could be altered to work on infrared regardless of clothing?

>> **u/Tenoke** [+1]  *Even the fuckin' trees walked in those movies* (4 days later)
>> 
>> Can you please use the spoiler tag in the future for comments like this one?

>>> **u/Calsem** [+1]  (4 days later)
>>> 
>>> I tried to look up how to do it but I didn't find out how.  Obviously I didn't do enough research because I now see the directions are on the sidebar.  Sorry >_<

> **u/alexanderwales** [+9]  *Time flies like an arrow* (39 minutes later)
> 
> Like some of Shiga's other work, in a lot of ways it's about problem solving, or taking the exploration of an idea to its limits. And in that respect, I think that it would appeal to people who visit this subreddit.
> 
> But even given Jimmy's complete disregard for human life, there are some problems with "because plot", namely with the organization tasked with bringing Jimmy in. I can forgive a lot of that, especially if I read in bursts instead of one page at a time, but it might bug some people, and it means that the story doesn't really stand up to too much scrutiny.
> 
> Jimmy doesn't quite meet all the criteria for sociopathy, but it's not just that he's willing to do anything to achieve his goals - it's that he simply does not take other peoples' lives into consideration. Like, there's a scene in one of the recent panels where he murders a man rather than going through the trouble of walking five feet. There's absolutely no question that he's evil, he just happens to be the protagonist.

>> **u/awesomeideas** [+2]  *Dai stiho, cousin.* (2 hours later)
>> 
>> The organization really doesn't seem to get the whole thing, unless there's some unknown and lengthy process to remove Jimmy from a person's body.

>>> **u/alexanderwales** [+12]  *Time flies like an arrow* (3 hours later)
>>> 
>>> I think they understand, they've just demonstrated some supreme incompetence in putting their plans into motion. What they want to do is get him in a position where he can't kill himself (or anyone else), presumably so that they can negotiate some kind of arrangement with him, though I have no idea what that would entail. I believe that there's quite a bit that we, the viewers, don't know about the organizations goals and purpose.
>>> 
>>> Anyway, there was one big moment of failure right near the beginning when Jimmy was trapped (and bleeding out) in a cell. Hunter tells him that he's going to die there and possess the guy in the next cell. *And then Hunter leaves*. In fact, everyone leaves. Jimmy is all alone, with no one watching him. More importantly, the guy in the next cell over - the one that Jimmy is supposed to possess when he dies - *hasn't been tranquilized by the OSS*. It's a mistake that I can understand them making, but that was the moment that it became clear Jimmy wasn't going up against intellectual champions.
>>> 
>>> So I enjoy the story, and I enjoy the puzzle aspects of it, but I don't look too closely, because the adversary is a little too incompetent.

>>>> **u/psychothumbs** [+3]  (16 hours later)
>>>> 
>>>> Yeah, not even leaving a video camera to keep watch? Really?

> **u/MoralRelativity** [+2]  (4 hours later)
> 
> > It's not as bad as it sounds, since the art style doesn't make it look too life-like or vivid, but it's fairly gross. Only for that chapter does it get that bad though, the rest only involves murder.
> 
> Hmmm... one reading of what you wrote is that creating "bodily fluids" is worse than murder. Is that really what you mean?

>> **u/jalapeno_dude** [+5]  (5 hours later)
>> 
>> I'm not the OP, but: In terms of grossness/squick, absolutely, yes. The murders are no more gruesome (considerably less, actually, given the art) than, say, the Game of Thrones TV series. That is decidedly not true for this particular scene.

>>> **u/MoralRelativity** [+1]  (19 hours later)
>>> 
>>> Thanks. See my reply to OP.

>> **u/xamueljones** [+3]  *My arch-enemy is entropy* (5 hours later)
>> 
>> Ha, ha, ha, ha...
>> You're right about that possible interpretation, but I can easily deal with reading about faceless NPCs being killed off in the background of the story. However, the artwork for the scene in question looks more gory than the scenes for all of the murders Jimmy commits. So even though murder is a worse action to commit, we certainly are more likely to read "The bullet went through his head." than a "His skull shattered as the grey matter of his brain oozed out of the bullet hole." Writers and drawers are rarely so vivid with gruesome scenes unless they are writing/drawing for that specific genre.

>>> **u/MoralRelativity** [+1]  (19 hours later)
>>> 
>>> Having re-read all the panels in that sequence I now agree with your "fairly gross" comments. Entirely (in my view) due to the blood running out of eyeballs, the pools of blood, the decapitation, and the many, many bodies. I still take issue with your original comment that there's a "very disgusting" method of suicide. In my view the murder of NPCs is much worse than that. It's just that society is more open about murder than masturbation.

>>>> **u/xamueljones** [+3]  *My arch-enemy is entropy* (22 hours later)
>>>> 
>>>> You are right.
>>>> 
>>>> When I made my original post, I was only thinking in terms of visuals, but I apologize if I unintentionally trivialized murder and methods of suicide. No matter how someone dies, it's a tragedy and a horrible thing to be prevented from ever happening again.
>>>> 
>>>> Still, thank you for taking the time to read my post and pointing out my insensitive writing.

>>>>> **u/MoralRelativity** [+1]  (a day later)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Ah, it's all cool mate. I just thought what you wrote shone a little light on the prevailing societal attitudes that's there all the time but we don't notice much. I really enjoy Demon and I eagerly check it each weekday for the next panel. Thanks for talking with me on this.

> **u/krakonfour** [+1]  (5 days later)
> 
> I discovered Shigabooks thanks to this post.
> 
> It is mindnumbingly good and the logic problems are exactly what I love. Have you noticed that Demon and Fleep have, like, the same MC?

>> **u/xamueljones** [+2]  *My arch-enemy is entropy* (6 days later)
>> 
>> It's deliberate on Shiga's part. He prefers to draw the same character in almost every single comic he's ever made. I sometimes imagine that the Jimmy in Demon acts sociopathic, because he remembers his experiences in Fleep and Meanwhile (it would give anyone Nightmare Fuel).

---