scrape_r_rational/data/cache2/8lspd9.md

## [FF] [hpmor] Unriddle the Riddles

* Author: u/melmonella  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you**
* URL: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yeRsGrlLGVW4Mq_K-xj3ilNBspyZS9PtCiRjHbM_res
* Score: 46

* Created: 2018-05-24T13:39:32

### Post:

[Link to content](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1yeRsGrlLGVW4Mq_K-xj3ilNBspyZS9PtCiRjHbM_res)

### Comments:

> **u/scruiser** [+18]  *CYOA* (an hour later)
> 
> Impressive story.  I had thought the idea of cooperating with Voldemort and Voldemort agreeing to cooperate would stretch my suspension of disbelief too much, but you actually sold me on it perfectly, keeping both Tom Riddles in character and building up to their deal well with just minor shifts from the original story.

>> **u/Sailor_Vulcan** [+11]  *Champion of Justice and Reason* (3 hours later)
>> 
>> I want to see what happens next. Please keep writing!

>>> **u/Sailor_Vulcan** [+10]  *Champion of Justice and Reason* (3 hours later)
>>> 
>>> Also, I think you should somehow work in the quote from taboo tradeoffs about how utilitarians were allowed to take common sense into account and how real life utilitarians dont actually rob banks to give to the poor. Then say something about how people aren't smarter than their ethics.
>>> 
>>> Situations where its best to violate your deontological ethical injunctions in order to accomplish greater good are rare, while also being easy to find and hard to check. The exact opposite of P=nP? problems.
>>> 
>>> One should be extremely skeptical and make absolutely sure that there is no other way before violating one's deontological ethical injunctions. And its almost always more likely that you've made a mistake then that it was really the optimal choice to break your ethics. It would have been a bit more believable if Harry hadn't been so easy to convince to do this.

>>> **u/melmonella** [+7]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (5 days later)
>>> 
>>> >And then Tom Riddles conquered the whole world, and nobody could stop them, for while one rationalist wizard is certainly overpowered, *two* of them working in concert is so unfair that even From Software doesn't think it's working as intended.

>>> **u/pleasedothenerdful** [+2]  (4 days later)
>>> 
>>> Me too!

>> **u/thrawnca** [+5]  *Carbon-based biped* (a day later)
>> 
>> >  I had thought the idea of cooperating with Voldemort and Voldemort agreeing to cooperate would stretch my suspension of disbelief too much,
>> 
>> Coming from Voldemort, sure. But perhaps the real Tom Riddle is completely, utterly, irredeemably evil in an interestingly different fashion from what he was pretending with Voldemort.

>>> **u/DuplexFields** [+3]  *New Lunar Republic* (7 days later)
>>> 
>>> An extremely powerful sociopath who is tired of stupid people, not an extremely powerful bigot who loves praise and adoration.

> **u/None** [+12]  (5 hours later)
> 
> [deleted]

>> **u/melmonella** [+10]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (5 hours later)
>> 
>> Good catch. Fixed.

>>> **u/pku31** [+5]  (7 hours later)
>>> 
>>> Also, you wrote balefire instead of fyndfire once or twice. Though I'm enough of a WOT fan to kinda prefer this anyway.
>>> 
>>> Edit: also, pretty great story. Enjoyed it a lot.

>>>> **u/melmonella** [+4]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (7 hours later)
>>>> 
>>>> > balefire 
>>>> 
>>>> It is that way in the original. Blame Yudkovsky.

> **u/SkyTroupe** [+6]  (16 hours later)
> 
> Are you going to rewrite the end too? Because I just read to them stepping out to set their plans in motion and Im craving more.

> **u/WalterTFD** [+4]  (3 hours later)
> 
> My 'solution' when the original dilemma was posted was in the same direction.  That is, the Unbreakable Vow fixes the trust problem, and should allow Harry's believable surrender to Voldemort.
> 
> I was less hopeful re: their cooperation, I tended to believe that this was a "maybe the horse will learn to sing", where Harry just set himself to service and hoped that Voldemort's reign wouldn't be so bad, or that someone else would do something.

> **u/Ristridin1** [+4]  (2 days later)
> 
> I liked it.
> 
> One point that I think should be expanded on is Voldemort accepting the premise that a prophecy has to be fulfilled. He's trying to kill people to stop the prophecy he heard, so at some level, he believes that prophecy can be averted (which is true, as Dumbledore mentions blocking other prophecies of destruction). So why does Voldemort so easily accept that this particular prophecy cannot be stopped? The answer 'it has already been partially fulfilled' seems a bit weak without any evidence that a prophecy has to be completely fulfilled or not at all.

>> **u/melmonella** [+2]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (13 days later)
>> 
>> Yeah, that came up when I was planning the story. Ultimately I decided that it would be best to leave that without justification, for two primary reasons.
>> 
>> * As far as I could find, there is no solid evidence for *or* against that in the original, other than the way the ending turned out. 
>> This means that I'd have to come up with evidence on the spot, which is a pretty bad writing move, and I think would have felt forced. This interpretation wasn't contradicted by anything, so I decided to let it pass.
>> 
>> * Intuitively, that seems like a more likely consequence of a  mechanism that might be behind the prophecy. 
>> 
>> Like, say I told you "my world has prophecies" and asked you to come up with a set of models for this world, with their simplicity rated according to Solomonof Induction. The most probable model would probably be "prophecies can't be averted" - you receive a bit string from the future, and then no matter what you do (with the string or otherwise) laws of physics ensure it ends up in the same state as it started when I went back in time. And then whatever mechanism that sends information back in time just sends that string back. This model gets a Bayesian update to pretty much zero probability from Dumbledore saying he averted some prophecies, and from QQ thinking that it's possible to avert prophecies.
>> 
>> The *second* most probable model, in my opinion, would be "Either the string gets sent back in time, or the negation of the string gets sent back in time" i.e. suppose that in the future the string would be 100110. Now either the past receives 011001(in which case prophecy was averted entirely in this timeline), or 100110 (in which case prophecy was fulfilled in this timeline). This is the second most simple algorithm for prophecies, and the one I went with. It also pretty much means that after you've observed and confirmed the first bit, you know how the other ones will end up.
>> 
>> Finally, you have even more complicated algorithms for prophecy information, such as "any part of the string can be fulfilled or averted, with some complicated relation between them that ensures prophecy still tells you *something* instead of being effectively white noise". I don't think those are *so* improbable as to not be worth considering, but they are still less probable on priors.
>> 
>> [Weaker arguments start here]
>> 
>> * Counterfactually, if it *was* possible to fulfill a prophecy just in part, QQ would have known about it and said as much. Since he didn't say anything, it's clearly not possible.
>> 
>> * As I've pointed out above, justifications of this would have felt forced and would have simply drawn more attention to this weak point. Since most people didn't seem to notice it, I feel that my sight deception had been successful.
>> 
>> But yeah, this is probably one of the weakest points of the fic, in my own authorial opinion. Very good catch.

> **u/vakusdrake** [+3]  (a day later)
> 
> See now I really want to read a sort of alt-universe version of significant digits based on this rewrite of the story.

>> **u/absolute-black** [+2]  (a day later)
>> 
>> ...Now I just wanna reread significant digits. Yay long weekends.

> **u/thrawnca** [+3]  *Carbon-based biped* (2 days later)
> 
> Presumably the Quirrellisation plan will need to be Snapproved as a valid prophecy resolution before they can proceed...

> **u/Areign** [+2]  (4 hours later)
> 
> very cool approach

> **u/Cuz_Im_TFK** [+2]  (16 hours later)
> 
> That was very fun. Thanks for that.

> **u/thrawnca** [+2]  *Carbon-based biped* (a day later)
> 
> Are you in the market for typos?

>> **u/melmonella** [+2]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (a day later)
>> 
>> Sure. I imagine I have quite a few there.

>>> **u/thrawnca** [+3]  *Carbon-based biped* (a day later)
>>> 
>>> There seem to be a lot of cases where the grammar resembles Parseltongue even after they're no longer speaking Parseltongue.
>>> 
>>> Chapter 1
>>> 
>>> a fight with Headmaster/a fight with the Headmaster
>>> 
>>> it can not/it cannot
>>> 
>>> I hope Dumbledore hadn't/I hope Dumbledore hasn't
>>> 
>>> What?, said Hufflepuff - the comma is unnecessary and a full stop is missing.
>>> 
>>> hogwarts/Hogwarts
>>> 
>>> actions? , said Ravenclaw - the comma is unnecessary and a full stop is missing.
>>> 
>>> even by my standards, said Slytherin - missing full stop and line break
>>> 
>>> Brittain/Britain
>>> 
>>> answered Ravenclaw, - should be a full stop, not a comma
>>> 
>>> Dark Rationalist isn't/A Dark Rationalist isn't
>>> 
>>> deciding wherever/deciding whether
>>> 
>>> gets a magical artifact/gets magical artifact
>>> 
>>> suggesting?, said Slytherin, - the first comma is unnecessary and the second should be a full stop.
>>> 
>>> why Professor is/why the Professor is
>>> 
>>> worth more than lives/worth more than the lives
>>> 
>>> What?, said Hufflepuff, - the first comma is unnecessary and the second should be a full stop.
>>> 
>>> a consequentialist you claim to be/the consequentialist you claim to be
>>> 
>>> Quirinous/Quirinus
>>> 
>>> you can not/you cannot
>>> 
>>> out?- said Slytherin - the first hyphen is unnecessary and the second should be a full stop.
>>> 
>>> function"-"if - missing spaces
>>> 
>>> Stone?" said Professor Quirrell - missing full stop.
>>> 
>>> ask for safety of/ask for the safety of
>>> 
>>> capital?, - the comma is unnecessary
>>> 
>>> probably should, said Slytherin, - the second comma should be a full stop, and there shouldn't be a line break afterward.
>>> 
>>> Natural death rate/The natural death rate
>>> 
>>> that human brain fell into/that the human brain fell into
>>> 
>>> Consequences of his choices/The consequences of his choices
>>> 
>>> Just to think,/Just think,
>>> 
>>> the oath Professor gave/the oath the Professor gave

>>>> **u/melmonella** [+2]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (2 days later)
>>>> 
>>>> > Stone?" said Professor Quirrell - missing full stop.
>>>> 
>>>> Man, that's especially embarrassing, given that I copied it over.
>>>> 
>>>> Thanks!

>>> **u/thrawnca** [+3]  *Carbon-based biped* (4 days later)
>>> 
>>> Chapter 2
>>> 
>>> what professor said/what the professor said
>>> 
>>> ensure the death is/ensure that death is
>>> 
>>> Chapter 3
>>> 
>>> I have preference/I have a preference
>>> 
>>> distract headmaster/distract the headmaster
>>> 
>>> sspeech",/sspeech,"
>>> 
>>> iss true"/iss true,"
>>> 
>>> scenario stone itself/scenario where the stone itself
>>> 
>>> hummed "Perhaps/hummed, "Perhaps
>>> 
>>> the murderer of hundreds possess/the murderer of hundreds, possess
>>> 
>>> taken hostage the lives of hundreds of hostages - it would be better not to reuse the word "hostage". Maybe "hundreds of students"?
>>> 
>>> wherever you seem evil/whether you seem evil
>>> 
>>> chuckled "Well/chuckled, "Well
>>> 
>>> under normal circumstances, "On my own/under normal circumstances. "On my own
>>> 
>>> sounded amused "I suppose/sounded amused. "I suppose
>>> 
>>> Maybe.", said Harry, "Severus/Maybe," said Harry. "Severus
>>> 
>>> "Explain yourself, boy - this line is supposed to have been hissed, but it doesn't use italics or double 's'.
>>> 
>>> "Patronus charm/"The Patronus charm
>>> 
>>> Wizard has to/The wizard has to
>>> 
>>> should one come." said/should one come," said
>>> 
>>> Chapter 4
>>> 
>>> of prisoner's dilemma/of the prisoner's dilemma
>>> 
>>> from Harry Voldemort had/from Harry, Voldemort had
>>> 
>>> One horcux/One horcrux (yes, this is in the original - but it's still an error)
>>> 
>>> wonderful inventive brain/wonderfully inventive brain
>>> 
>>> chuckled "Are you/chuckled, "Are you
>>> 
>>> forces himself to grin "Yes/forced himself to grin. "Yes
>>> 
>>> chuckled "Perhaps./chuckled, "Perhaps.
>>> 
>>> mirror-Professor/mirror; Professor
>>> 
>>> accident",/accident,"
>>> 
>>> level "if/level, "if
>>> 
>>> Harry said "Why/Harry said, "Why
>>> 
>>> look very differently/look very different
>>> 
>>> Harry shrugged "Your/Harry shrugged, "Your
>>> 
>>> Oh and five,/Oh, and five,
>>> 
>>> plenty successes/plenty of successes
>>> 
>>> start of the year by using/start of the year, by using
>>> 
>>> husbands never cheating is/husbands never cheating, is
>>> 
>>> so easy to do people/so easy to do that people
>>> 
>>> behavior/behaviour (HPMoR appears to use British English)
>>> 
>>> behaviors/behaviours
>>> 
>>> the thousands years/thousands of years
>>> 
>>> Discrepancy between/The discrepancy between
>>> 
>>> this "I assume/this, "I assume
>>> 
>>> But human mind/But the human mind
>>> 
>>> not as wholesome/not as unified
>>> 
>>> hissed "Iss/hissed, "Iss
>>> 
>>> mission to Azkaban has almost/mission to Azkaban almost
>>> 
>>> you have not expected/you had not expected
>>> 
>>> Prophecy seemed to/The prophecy seemed to
>>> 
>>> professor Quirrell/Professor Quirrell

>>>> **u/melmonella** [+2]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (4 days later)
>>>> 
>>>> Nice! More typos!

>>> **u/thrawnca** [+3]  *Carbon-based biped* (6 days later)
>>> 
>>> Chapter 5
>>> 
>>> if Mirror/if the Mirror (occurs multiple times)
>>> 
>>> professor Quirrell/Professor Quirrell
>>> 
>>> Quirrell?", said Harry, - the first comma is unnecessary and the second should be a full stop.
>>> 
>>> Quirrel/Quirrell (occurs multiple times)
>>> 
>>> smirked "This/smirked. "This
>>> 
>>> Quil/Quill
>>> 
>>> in english alphabet/in the English alphabet
>>> 
>>> use International/use the International
>>> 
>>> artefact/artifact (normally it seems to use UK spellings, but this chapter started with "artifact")
>>> 
>>> said "Well/said, "Well
>>> 
>>> "Yes"/"Yes."
>>> 
>>> likely that Headmaster/likely that the Headmaster
>>> 
>>> Barrier around/The barrier around
>>> 
>>> force him to waste time/forcing him to waste time
>>> 
>>> so world would/so the world would
>>> 
>>> interfere", hissed Harry,/interfere," hissed Harry.
>>> 
>>> use you as hostage/use you as a hostage
>>> 
>>> Though unexpected can/Though the unexpected can
>>> 
>>> Chapter 6
>>> 
>>> as Circle/as the Circle
>>> 
>>> Final sacrifice/A final sacrifice
>>> 
>>> he felt "I wouldn't/he felt. "I wouldn't
>>> 
>>> chuckled "Are you/chuckled. "Are you
>>> 
>>> hissed "What/hissed, "What
>>> 
>>> Chapter 7
>>> 
>>> eye twitched "Sstop/eye twitched. "Sstop
>>> 
>>> it's true meaning/its true meaning
>>> 
>>> right?", said Harry./right?" said Harry.
>>> 
>>> "Yess." hissed/"Yess," hissed
>>> 
>>> , fulfillment of the prophecy must/, the fulfillment of the prophecy must
>>> 
>>> universe?", Harry had/universe?" Harry had
>>> 
>>> from himself, "I think/from himself. "I think
>>> 
>>> similar.", Harry smiled,/similar." Harry smiled.
>>> 
>>> , sun too relies/, the sun too relies
>>> 
>>> it's output/its output
>>> 
>>> harry/Harry
>>> 
>>> and door of/and the door of
>>> 
>>> opposite of the dead/opposite the dead
>>> 
>>> alsso.",/alsso."
>>> 
>>> Then three things/Then the three things
>>> 
>>> a couple times/a couple of times
>>> 
>>> "reasoning makes/"your reasoning makes
>>> 
>>> Unbreakable Oath/Unbreakable Vow
>>> 
>>> in return "Have/in return, "Have
>>> 
>>> professor Quirrell/Professor Quirrell (occurs multiple times)
>>> 
>>> Harry said "The/Harry said, "The
>>> 
>>> Harry grimaced "I/Harry grimaced. "I
>>> 
>>> rolled his eyes "Mister/rolled his eyes. "Mister
>>> 
>>> I?", said Harry,/I?" said Harry.
>>> 
>>> I can not/I cannot
>>> 
>>> "Well, little reason/"Well, there is little reason
>>> 
>>> prophecised/prophesied
>>> 
>>> if universe itself/if the universe itself
>>> 
>>> and said "Well/and said, "Well
>>> 
>>> , sound as cold/, the sound as cold
>>> 
>>> Harry shrugged "Sorry/Harry shrugged. "Sorry
>>> 
>>> wherever you want to/whether you want to (occurs multiple times)
>>> 
>>> Would be a shame/It would be a shame
>>> 
>>> child",/child,"
>>> 
>>> catasstrophy/catasstrophe (occurs multiple times)
>>> 
>>> then hissed "Even if/then hissed, "Even if
>>> 
>>> Harry shrugged "I am/Harry shrugged. "I am
>>> 
>>> "Vow doesn't/"The Vow doesn't
>>> 
>>> sighed "That is/sighed. "That is
>>> 
>>> shrugged "We should/shrugged. "We should
>>> 
>>> Quirrel/Quirrell
>>> 
>>> a couple different ways/a couple of different ways
>>> 
>>> a couple interpretations/a couple of interpretations
>>> 
>>> Dark Lord Voldemort was/The Dark Lord Voldemort was
>>> 
>>> , Unbreakable Vow required/, an Unbreakable Vow required
>>> 
>>> , one who was taking/, the one who was taking
>>> 
>>> Sacrificed trust/The sacrificed trust
>>> 
>>> , magic of the one/, the magic of the one
>>> 
>>> Magic of the vow-binder/The magic of the vow-binder
>>> 
>>> Mask of professor Quirrell/The mask of Professor Quirrell
>>> 
>>> and drama could/and some drama could
>>> 
>>> like I have mentioned/as I have mentioned
>>> 
>>> Would immediately put us/This would immediately put us
>>> 
>>> Brittain/Britain
>>> 
>>> minutes have swiftly passed/minutes swiftly passed
>>> 
>>> Dramatic return/The dramatic return

>>>> **u/melmonella** [+3]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (7 days later)
>>>> 
>>>> Figures, the chapter I wrote at 4 am has the most typos. Fixed. Many thanks for your work!

> **u/Zephyr1011** [+2]  *Potentially Unfriendly Aspiring Divinity* (3 days later)
> 
> I really, really enjoyed this. Eagerly awaiting more!

> **u/SansFinalGuardian** [+2]  (5 days later)
> 
> Great story, horrible grammar. I have an urge to go through it all and correct everything.

>> **u/melmonella** [+3]  *Tremble, o ye mighty, for a new age is upon you* (5 days later)
>> 
>> Thank you! If you do go through it, I'll be very thankful.

> **u/callmesalticidae** [+2]  *writes worldbuilding books* (13 days later)
> 
> This is everything I had hoped the original would be. It’s fantastic, I love it, thank you for writing it.

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